TRIBALISM

achetocuddle

I have a fairly uninformed opinion about tribalism. It is obvious from reading another thread that many people here probably have interesting views of tribalism and I would love to hear them.

It seems to me tribalism was a good and necessary thing in early human history. A lot of tribes did tend to fight, but I think people would tend to fight regardless. It seems tribalism helped the human race and individuals survive in ways I cannot articulate (it's up to you if think the human race surviving was a good thing) Lol. And it seemed to work the best? before the earth became very populated. Would love to learn more.

cuddles_ndream

It is up to you to think of the human race surviving was a good thing lol @achetocuddle

That sentence reminded me of this 4 minute video, hope you enjoy

TheFunCartel

The way it was used earlier today was analogous to early human history but it is not the same. He was using it in the sense of groups with distinct lines of demarcation without much room, if any, for compromise. You could say it is like criminal gangs but criminal gangs will switch alliances if it monetarily behooves them to do so. And early human history was about survival.

Today, tribalism is about power and race. Whites will soon be the minority in this country and that scares many and so they band together to preserve their wealth and power. Others see the American Dream as a lie that is blocked off from them, so they band together because the status quo for the past 200 plus years denies them power. Neither side will budge much and a couple of the few things they have in common they won’t do—talk and listen.

CrissyKat

Go Braves!

JohnR1972

@FunCartel - that is definitely a good example of what I was talking about but I like your definition even better. I was using the term very loosely so it could also include old vs young, straight vs LBTQ, natural born citizens vs immigrants, etc.

I personally dislike the new Nike Ad with Spike Lee because to me it promotes polarization. He talks about having seen it all and the younger woman in the commercial tells him “you ain’t seen anything”.

I get it that it is just a commercial and it builds on a classic commercial from years ago. I just don’t like the polarizing message. Older people have not seen everything but they have seen a lot. Older people may not be up to speed on a lot of things younger people know about but that doesn’t mean they “haven’t seen anything”. To me, the commercial sets up two diametrically opposed positions that are equally wrong and tend to reinforce negative stereotypes about both groups.

Most "isms" have the same short term benefits, followed by long term detriments.

I find it is preferable, if of course exceedingly difficult, to keep my mind as open as possible, see the situation or person in front of me for what they are (and not for whatever labels an "Ism" might attach) and work from there.

UCpaaHVg6u0

Tribalism meant survival. It turned the affinity within the group into a hardened tool capable of defeating the forces of nature that a lone person would have succumbed to. As we survive differently today, we have the luxury of rejecting it.

CharlieBear

Does me arguing with myself in the shower count? Those two don’t seem to agree on anything 😅

Tribalism is why we have been seeing the dark side of politics in the past 5 or so years. People want to be loyal to their tribe and will do almost anything not to get kicked out., even when they know they are wrong. Lots of people like being in their tribe and think the way to show loyalty to your tribe s to hate the other tribe.

CharlieBear

I have been trying to figure out what tribes I am part of and am taking a stand on some very important issues.

PlayStation > Xbox
iOS > Android
Taco Bell > Real Mexican Food (just kidding)
Windows > Mac
“jif” > “gif”
Star Wars Original Trilogy > Star Wars Prequels/Sequels
LG > Samsung
Pokémon > Digimon
MCU > DCEU
Heinz > Hunts
Toaster Strudels > Pop Tarts
Bagel Bites > Pizza Rolls
Toilet Paper Over > Toilet Paper Under
Fortnite > Warzone
Platonic Cuddling > Everything else

achetocuddle

This is what I was looking for. Thank you!

@Charlie_Bear LOL. Star Wars Original Trilogy is so much better. And toilet paper is supposed to go over!

SunsetSnuggles

@Charlie_Bear posted:
"Toaster Strudels > Pop Tarts
Bagel Bites > Pizza Rolls
Toilet Paper Over > Toilet Paper Under

You, sir, rock! 😎

~ Sunset Snuggles

CharlieBear

@achetocuddle @SunsetSnuggles hehe thank you thank you

There isn't much need for being part of a tribe as 10k years ago (survival), so the definition has evolved (as things do). Not it's really just about surrounding yourself with like-minded people to reinforce narratives and not just just politics. It's all ideologies really. Catholicism for example; if you subscribe to that ideology, now you hate protestants and baptists. Subscribe to being conservative, not you hate liberals. Being on a. "team," now means you're sacrificing independent and complex thought and attacking people that disagree instead of listening. This is why ideologies and echo chambers are dangerous because what's happening, because of social media, is people are surrounding themselves that gang up and now instead of having an actual conversation with someone, you're talking in bullet points and a gaggle of people follw-up with your perspective and now ten people are calling the person that disagrees an, "idiot," and this is all being done with a complete disregard to social ques and skills. Tribalism now, instead of survival, is let's just attack someone that disagrees with any idea you may have instead of engaging in thoughful discourse.

There's tons of talk about, "identity politics," which means subscribing to ideologies means you get married to them and there's no room for any perspective shifts. An inability to think for yourself and going neck deep into a way of belief is now your identity and when that identity is challenged, that person becomes defensive instead of logical and vulnerable understanding what communication actual is because now, like I said, people talk in bullet points and there isn't any consequences when words are spoken in text. It's just the, "wild west," of communication now which feeds so much into the polarization that's happeng. LAck of communication skills anda huge desire to find a team (tribe).

Sorry for all the typos. I'm stoned and thinking faster than I can type.

achetocuddle

So glad Saysoh chimed in. I did not tag him on purpose. I leave it to him to revisit this thread if he wants. But I like his big stoned brain and critical thinking. How much I agree or disagree is beside the point. In this thread I do agree.

Lack of critical thinking is sending this world down the drain. Maybe I will not be here when it starts circling.

It's interesting that Saysoh commented on Protestants and Baptists separately. That may not have been intentional, but I thought it was a good detailed way to put it.

Really glad so many people posted on this thread. I value your posts and thought processes.

TheMidnightOwl

A perusing of work within social psychology should clear up any questions one might have on this topic. Cliff notes: In-group status = survival and positive effects on individuals. Out-group status = deeply painful; loneliness/social rejection is the health equivalent of smoking a pack of cigarettes a day. People in groups = unbelievably stupid, mostly in order to not be cast out from the in-group which leads to “us vs them” dichotomies. People in groups also = bystander effect.

achetocuddle

@TheMidnightOwl Thanks for the suggestion and they synopsis. I love to read nonfiction but it would have taken a while to find the right book/article/etc. Plus I really like to hear the thoughts such as the ones posted here.

JohnR1972

@TheMidnightOwl - I agree with your comment and it reminds me of the great line from Tommy Lee Jones in the original “Men in Black” movie.

Will Smith claims “people are smart”. Jones replies “a person is smart, but people are stupid.”

Edited to correct a typo.

LondonHug

@achetocuddle This thread prompted me to read around a bit, I should have saved time and waited for @TheMidnightOwl’s fine summary 😀. One point to add is that mistrust of the ‘other’ is an ingrained fear response emanating from the amygdala. A non tribe member may be an aggressor or carry a new disease. The fear response made sense for survival in the societies in which we evolved but tends to be maladaptive in modern life. It can be counteracted with an open, tolerant culture but is a visceral instinct that can easily be revived, amplified and exploited for political gain.

I might add there’s something about those non cuddlers I really do not trust 😏

@LondonHug

What is it about non-cuddlers do you not trust?

LondonHug

@Saysoh It’s just a play on the subject of this thread i.e. cuddle forum members forming the in group

@LondonHug

Ok, word. I only asked because I've been on the site for a year, hired one cuddler, and am a non-cuddler (professionally). I thought it was an opportunity to share an experience.

LondonHug

@Saysoh ah no, it was a really weak attempt at humour on my part 🙂 The UK scene is pretty quiet outside London. Despite my user name, I’m outside London right now but when I eventually get back I’d go ahead and arrange a couple of sessions to compare.

Even after you take into account population differences, the US seems to be way ahead on number of professionals, enthusiasts and even forum engagement.

@LondonHug

I can't lie, I read your comments in a UK accent (I know there's variants) in my head. I have a friend from Scotland and when I talk to her, I start adopting her accent. Such a weird thing.

achetocuddle

@LondonHug LOL.

LondonHug

@Saysoh the Scottish accent makes make think of a few comedians. Not sure if this guy has an international profile but if you can decipher the accent hopefully the comedy translates

Dilly60

@LondonHug thank you for sharing the video it was hilarious 🤣

@LondonHug

I can. When we first met, she had punched down on her accent, but over time, she let her accent out gradually (so Americans can understand her). Then, she went back home and I got to talk to her brothers and understood everything they said. I'm a HUGE fan of comedy and she also pointed me in his direction. He's hilarious, to be honest. I love him.

Babichev

I suspect the tendency towards tribalism is ingrained. It can be harmless - like affiliation with a sports team - or destructive, as with racism, nationalism, orthodoxy, and all the other destructive forms of us/them that exist.

For the record, while oxytocin is bandied about as the “feel good” hormone that increases feelings of affection towards others, research has been found that it increases feelings of affection towards those in one’s in-group but also tends to make us behave worse towards to outsiders.

Here’s an article by noted researcher Robert Sapolsky on why we engage in tribalism, nationalism, and scapegoating:
https://psmag.com/social-justice/why-we-engage-in-tribalism-nationalism-and-scapegoating

I think the best we can do is, as with any form of prejudice, to be aware that this tendency can exist in all of us and take steps not to be unwittingly held captive by it.

JohnR1972

@Babichev 💯 agree!

LondonHug

@Dilly60 @Saysoh great to hear the Kevin Bridges routine went down well. House rice 😆

@saysoh did she point you to Frankie Boyle? I didn’t link here as he tends to be deliberately more provocative and his comedy typically needs more UK political context to be funny. Still you might like him if you are a big comedy fan and your friend hasn’t shared yet