Pros are not all in it just for money

Kai816

When you find a pro within your area that you would like to possibly book a session with, please remember your manners when contacting them.

A blunt “when are you available” as a first message would be fine if that were a general question about the hours and days I do sessions, but it’s not because that info is in my main profile. Without even an introduction the person wants to know my address and when they can come over...it makes for a lousy first contact.

I sometimes I get greeted worse than a salesperson or cashier does. It’s that blunt and abrupt message with no hi, or anything.

I do offer massages in addition to cuddling as it helps people relax more. I will be having you in my home, in my arms, touching and caressing you, talking and listening to you. So please remember that when you’re booking a pro, although it is a business, it’s even more so when you keep in mind the contact & personal attention given to every individual client that’s involved.

Cuddling is even more than massages, it’s closeness and caring. Wether I’m opening my home to a client or if I’m going to theirs, a trust needs to be built first. I fiercely believe in my clients right to privacy and so that they know they are safe with me and will not be judged.

Masseuses do massages, and yes you get touched, but sometimes even that is mechanical in nature. Not only do they get paid, but most expect tips. I, as a Pro cuddler would like the same amount of respect you would give to them. They’re making you feel good, and you pay them without complaining that they’re only in it for the money. Yet we as Pros, get accused of that exact thing, and we’re doing the same if not more for our clients, at least I am.

In fact, I think I am personally more invested in my clients than any masseuse is... and I don’t even expect a tip. I have contact with clients before and after sessions through chats, messages, video calls and texts. Yes, I’m getting paid, but a lot of hours of my time and feelings go into every session and client, before, during and afterwards. I give my clients a safe haven to relax and be open about whatever they need to. I’m a person to whom they can talk to when they feel they can’t express their feelings to coworkers, friends or family.

You pay a therapist to listen to you, you pay a masseuse to touch you. Both without complaint. I consider myself a bit of both. I am not in it only for the money.
Why should a pro cuddler be treated any differently?

quietman775

Ah, @Kai816 I think what's really at play here is the general decline of manners. It's not that people don't comprehend the personal nature of the service they are seeking; and I don't think they consciously view you as less worthy of civility than a masseuse, or anything like that. It's just that, in the Internet Age, expectations surrounding general manners went out the window a long time ago.

Witness the numerous forum threads wherein people lament that they send nice, polite messages to both enthusiasts and pros, and frequently don't get a reply from either. The consensus, repeated so often that it's practically a mantra, is "nobody owes you that." To express disappointment that people are not reasonably responsive and polite is seen as acting "entitled."

On the theory that what's good for the goose is good for the gander, some people might insist that nobody owes you a thoughtful or respectful approach, and that lamenting the lack thereof is acting entitled. But not me. I agree that asking a pro for a cuddle is not like asking a DMV clerk for her office hours. The brusque mannerisms you describe create a deficit of good vibes --- you have to struggle to get back up to a neutral feeling. Why not let every interaction be positive from the get-go? Why not build some bilateral anticipation for the cuddle? The answer is that this takes effort many are unwilling to invest.

You posted a similar thread before, lamenting the kind of introductory messages you get. Maybe you're hoping a little instruction will get the light bulb to go on over people's heads. Unfortunately, I think it's a matter of philosophy, not education. People already know what good manners look like. Many just don't care. All of the patient and detailed explanations in the world won't change that.

Or maybe I'm just feeling pessimistic today. :-/

naveed

Awesome post - I agree wholeheartedly. It really turns me off when a professional cuddler is too professional to the point of being clinical/mechanical.
However, one professional cuddler tells me that she prefers direct, to the point message seeking appointment straight away. Any rapport she wants to build, she would do that in person. That way, she can fast weed out all the time wasters and deal with the actual clients who are willing and able to pay. I find it a convincing explanation.

anastasija

Hmm this is interesting. I have gotten some requests recently that ask to talk on the phone first to see if we have anything in common, our energy syncs, things along those lines.
Personally, I would not talk on the phone just to convince a client to see me. Usually if they are that apprehensive about booking a session, a phone conversation is not going to ease their minds.
Also I generally avoid talking on the phone as I communicate much, much better in person.
Booking a session normally requires a leap of faith in both the client and pro, so many ask for an hour first and go from there. I think some degree of uncertainty comes with the territory on both sides as no one likes to waste their time.
Am I alone on my opinion of phone conversations before booking a session? Or is this more normal?

UKGuy

@anastasija - I think talking on the phone may be a generational thing. My two daughters, both in their 20's, almost never phone, they both primarily text or talk in person. Personally, I like talking on the phone because I like to hear a person's voice. However, it wouldn't be a deal breaker for me if the other person was not comfortable phoning.

I went through it. It was helpful to me, to hear that the person was cheerful, professional and amiable. It dissolved a lot of my apprehensions. Had there been no call, I would still have met the person and found out then, the same thing. But having a lot of concerns being laid-to-rest, before going, calmed my "first cuddle" nerves.

Kai816

@naveed i too want to weed out time wasters etc, but I don’t want to just make an appointment and hope that when i meet them in person that they will be a safe person to be meeting. I can week out creepy people in a quick video chat.
Also, being as some of my clients drive a ways to see me, I wouldn’t ask someone to drive 2 hours for just a meet to find out we have no commectiion or we’re not comfortable with one another. You can’t have a good session without that. You’re gonna either not have a session after the meet or have one that can be potentially dangerous, or awkward where the client or you want to end it early.

Then you have actually wasted more time, and most likely will not gain a repeat client.

Kai816

@UKGuy
I usually ask for a video chat. This way we can talk and I can study facial features, voice inflections, see if their twitchy or fidgety or seem to loose their cool quickly. Then it’s a definite no if I get that gut feeling or creepy vibe from them.

Kai816

@anastasija
Why does it have to be a booking on faith? There’s nothing wrong with a half hour phone call or video chat. I would rather do that then take my chances meeting in public or asking them to travel a far distance to meet face to face without the guarantee of having a session afterwards.

I’m sorry, but I have experienced a lot of bad things in my life from men as a girl growing up that I’d rather not experience again. There’s no reason to take risks when I don’t have to. If they don’t want a video chat or to share a photo, or even talk on the phone, then those are red flags not to meet with someone.

@Kai816
What does a massage therapist, counselor, psychiatrist, and psychologist have in common? They went to college to get some of degree or certificate. They go threw extensive training to help people in there specific fields of study to become certified. On here, you just have to agree to cuddle comfort rules. You can pick whoever you want to cuddle of your choosing of course. You can analyze whatever reasoning you want for being a pro on here. It's your opinion and personal past. You can't associate that with hard real facts.

Kai816

@roadtrip99
What about other services. Customer service, waitress, other people who help us in daily life. We don’t say they’re just in it for the money, but they are. To that point, what masseuse or therapist has checked in with you of their own accord after sessions to see how you are? I’ve been to both and the answer is none. Once you are done paying then, they’re gone.
All I’m saying is I’m not and not all Pros on this website are either and we shouldn’t be lumped into the same bowl when we are all individuals and deserve to be treated with manners and respect.

Earning a living is not a sin or shameful.

Ratios of men-to-women, ratios of pros-to-non pros, your own experiences and feelings have no bearing on that other person's right to pursue freedom, joy, prosperity.

I was taught a lesson more than 30 years ago. You can try to skew what I am saying if you want but, it goes something like this, "If someone is willing to pay you for your work, or if someone offers to pay you for something you do or have done, do not turn it down. It is WORTH it to that person. It gives them value that they want to repay."

As to the cost, free-market ideas will tell you that the market will bear whatever it will bear. That doesn't mean that everyone can afford it. It doesn't make it unfair or evil, just because some cannot afford it.

Peace

pmvines

@roadtrip99 I don't think anybody is making the comparison of cuddling with being an attorney, psychiatrist, math teacher, or the like. You are making a false equivalence argument. Not everybody has formal training for a skill or service or craft or something that people pay them to do . I do agree that simply signing up on a website doesn't make somebody a professional of anything, which is why I don't like to use the term pro cuddler. However it still doesn't mean that they should be criticized for charging for it. If someone is wiling to pay for a service, so be it. You do you and let them do them.

naveed

@pmvines Why can't professional cuddling be compared to other professions like doctors, attorney, or psychiatrists? Professional cuddling is still at infancy, not a mature profession, but It is a profession like any other. There was a time when there was no medical or law school - practitioners used to pick up the skills through learning by doing. All new professions start informally. Only at a much later stage credentialing and professional schools are set up.

pmvines

@naveed It is apples and oranges. I do not downplay the importance of touch nor do I minimize what a cuddler does. But I do not romanticize it as being something that it is not. Nor do most cuddlers who have healthy, reality based self awareness. C does not have to be the same as D for it to still be important and useful. I have myself brought up the subject in previous threads that perhaps standardization of practice and licensing would bring more credibility and support. However that is a big undertaking, and would require consensus among the cuddlers as to whether they would want this. Not really something I can speak for.

Kai816

@pmvines
@naveed

@galowglass
Thank you for your input to this topic. I agree it’s in its infancy. I think positive Karma, aka reviews here is a great start.

I know that I put a lot of work into what I do as a cuddler, and that I deserve to be paid for that.

I’m cuddles, someone to talk or vent to, or an uninvested 3rd party to give advice, maybe just a massage. I play zen or nature music on my iPad to set a relaxing atmosphere. In addition to a darkened room with soft candlelight, I turn off my cell to give my client 100% of my attention.

I put out & purchase toiletries, candles, and water bottles. I log every potential client in my contacts with their name, pic and profile name. I put notes under every contact such as likes, dislikes, allergies whether I can wear scented lotion or perfume or not…
To me, besides helping people, I am working.

pmvines

@Kai816 there is certainly a good deal of emotional labor that goes unnoticed

quietman775

I think pros are under-appreciated by many, and not just for the reasons already enumerated in this thread. I’m not talking about how much of themselves they pour into the work, or the expenses they incur, or even their motivation for doing the work. I’m saying that from the point of view of pure client self-interest, pros are underappreciated.

My current cuddle count stands at 41 pros (from multiple sites) and 7 enthusiasts. From that base of experience, I have observed the following benefits of dealing with pros:

1. Cuddles on demand. If I’m having a hard week at work and decide I could use a cuddle break, I can generally line up an appointment with a pro within a day or three --- even if it’s my first contact with that pro. Try that with an enthusiast!
2. Fewer complications. The typical pro isn’t going to fall in love, dream of a relationship, or demand to know why you haven’t texted in a whole week. Nor will she be jealous of the other three pros you snuggled this month. All of those things are significant statistical risks with enthusiasts, unless you are actually looking for a dating relationship. I’m not, and seeing pros keeps that whole idea off the table. Pros let you have your cuddles with no strings attached.
3. Stability of the arrangement. Most (not all) enthusiasts I have met were single, and looking for cuddle buddies only until they landed a significant other. The moment they did, they stopped being available for cuddles. By contrast, I’ve got pros that I have cuddled for years, regardless of what was going on in their love lives.

Put those three things together with someone with excellent cuddle skills, and that’s worth money to me. I know this thread was started to counter the charge that pros are “just in it for the money.” But I honestly wouldn’t care if they were. As long as I can get a superlative cuddle experience, practically whenever I want it, and without risk of emotional complications --- then I don’t care what her primary motivation is! So… three cheers for pros!

Kai816

@quietman775
Even though you say your contribution to the thread was not meant to counter the charge, I feel you helped prove my point exactly. I started this thread not to prove or disprove the claim, but to simply, as a pro cuddler, to express my opinions on a term that I’ve been hearing a lot.

Like any other business person performing a service, we deserve that out potential respect the time and efforts we put into every client.

Other professionals would charge a fee if you were late or cancelled last minute. We’re supposed to do so too, but we have no way to enforce it. We can invoice them through PayPal but all they have to do is ignore it and within minutes, they can delete their account and set up a new one. I as a pro cuddler cannot. If I want to keep my clients, I need to keep the same profile so they can find me. So I don’t lose the Karma I’ve built up, which I am very proud of.

We don’t necessarily need cheers, but just manners and respect, like you would give any person.

@pmvines
You are correct as well. I’m not here as an in between boyfriend distraction, but that doesn’t mean I don’t have an emotional investment in my clients either. I talk with my clients frequently, before and after sessions through many platforms. The after session conversations are not to work on a follow up session, but to check in with their well being.

There are plenty of good caring Pros but I'm sure there are some who are in it for the cash grab aspect.

MarvinNYC

Kai is great cuddler and is certainly not in it just to make money, IMHO. She cares about her clients, genuinely likes to cuddle and has reasonable rates.

Kai816

@MarvinNYC
Thank you so much. Miss u!
@chococuddles
Yes I agree there are some who are in it for the quick cash gram, but there are ways to avoid them by having conversations wether by calling, video chats, messsages here or texts. If they aren’t responding much, just pushing to make an appointment, then you have your answer.
We, as Pros, pros can screen out the creepy and red flag people, but clients can also screen Pros to weed out the quick cash grabbers.
My hope, although unrealistic p, is that is more clients screen and avoid cash grabbers, that the more cuddlers avoid them, there will be less and less of them, if they’re not booking appointments then maybe they’ll leave the site and delete their account.

CreativeCuddles

Not all pro’s are in it for the money but don’t try and belittle a pro by expecting what you pay them to include the hotel, all her traveling fee’s, etc., drive almost 5 hours and expect them to do all that when her hourly fee is $75 and all you are willing to pay her is 100$ for gas, tolls, etc., including the cuddle time.

Kai816

@CreativeCuddles
I totally agree. Actually I just posted a similar idea in the Pros only forum.
I myself do not travel far distances. But If I did I would probably use the US current rate of 54.5 cents per mile as a base guideline, and either adjust my hourly rate accordingly or just charge an additional flat fee on top of it.

CreativeCuddles

@Kai816 I don’t travel distances too far either but I have that I will travel in my profile and I will however this request is common sense even to those that don’t cuddle. This request was a 10 hour round trip drive that is excluding stops for gas food whatever. Which 100$ was offered and for 10 hours drive client only wanted to cuddle for 2-3 hours. Really? Absolutely not! I told him there must be cuddlers closer to him, he said he looked. He said I have looked and you are who I want to cuddle with. I said I am sorry but I just cannot do a 10 hour drive for that.

Kai816

@CreativeCuddles
I totally agree to that. Always go with your gut.
K