The profile mention of "wants children"

ercjncpr

I don't know if this has been asked or answered before. I was wondering why the profile question of wants or doesn't want children. If all cuddling is supposed to be platonic, why would I want to know if a female cuddler wants kids? Seems a bit of a non platonic question to me

hogboblin

Maybe it’s meant to help discern another person’s values?

For example, I think that creating life is utterly reprehensible. If I’m with a cuddle-partner, chatting idly, and they bring up wanting children some day, then I’ll likely respect them far less. Which could make things awkward.

JCat

I agree that it is a bit of a personal non platonic question. Something that is more akin to a long term relationship dating site and could lead others to think about long term non platonic intentions.

Mark

Deleted

pmvines

@Mark if you read @hogboblin posts most of them are sarcastic and likely meant to be tongue in cheek, I can only suppose this to be the case with above

tallteddy

I think the point of that feature is understanding the other's home situation at least in the sense of has kids/has no kids. It's good to know in advance if the other is in a situation where the time you can cuddle and the place you can cuddle is dictated by their family life.

But the question is if it's any use to anyone wether or not you want children. It could be an indication of wether or not someone is okay to cuddle while there's children around. Not sure otherwise.

Catloaf

@tallteddy I think in that case the field should be renamed as such. "Has children/Has no children". Or have the option to leave that field blank. I'm a pro and my relationship status as well as family plans really have nothing to do with people on here and it isn't something I want them to glean at. The way it's worded now calls back to intent to have children or not have children which is totally something you are more likely to see on dating websites. I even changed my marital status on here to single, as well as taking all mention of my husband out of my website. Because all I got were trolls who were emailing me on my contact form asking how it feels to neglect your husband's need for intimacy whilst getting paid for it elsewhere, and other garbage.

I'm of the opinion that it shouldn't be here at all, but I also agree with other commenters too that it could be read into differently.

hogboblin

@pmvines

This is an instance where I’m being completely serious. For reals, no joke.

The more I consider it, the more I think that the information (regarding wanting children) provides insight into a person’s values. It is, in my mind, similar to asking an individual what their religion might be, if they’re religious at all.

Creating life is utterly reprehensible? Are you angry with your parents for having you? Do you have little or no respect for them simply because you were born?

hogboblin

@Spoonie

You seem personally invested in a small part of something that I posted. Feel free to reconsider your question(s), and to then ask them in a private message.

You made your comments in a public forum and I responded in the same forum. No need for me to reconsider. Seems to me to be a reasonable question given your earlier statement.

hogboblin

@Spoonie

All right then. Here we go. Responses to your questions. I hope that your curiosity is satiated.

I think so.

No.

No.

pmvines

My take as a parent re the kids/no kids thing is that it might give you a talking point or a feel for some things you might have in common which is important regardless of the context or intent of your interaction with somebody. However I can also see how it is akin to something more prevalent on a dating site which is something CC tries not to be.

pmvines

@hogboblin I give you respect for your opinion and belief for not wanting to have children. I hope one day you will learn to have tolerance on this matter and do the same for others who do not feel the same as you on this subject. It is in no way akin to ones point of view on religion as you have compared the two to be. As both a single parent and an atheist, I can attest to this.

@hogboblin's first comment addressed this discussion's topic perfectly: I agree, it's probably a values thing. Like @tallteddy said, knowing whether your cuddle buddy actually has kids or not is a practical thing, but knowing whether they want kids? That's belief-and-personality information.

Going off-topic à la @Spoonie: if you believe that consent is important, you shouldn't give someone life without being sure they want it. And how could you ever be sure of that?

Personally, I'm glad I'm alive. I like life and want all of it I can get (even though a lot of it is miserable). If I could have been asked whether I wanted to exist before I started existing, I would have said yes. But my parents didn't know that when they made me; they were just lucky I wanted what they were giving, because I might not have.

Returning to the subject, I guess it is a standard dating-type question. But so is "favorite movie."

hogboblin

@pmvines

My saying that it was similar to asking what a person’s religious beliefs might be was solely in regards to information that is displayed on one’s profile. As a means to possibly compare and contrast personal values.

I’m pretty tolerant of people who decide to breed. I don’t go around handing out pamphlets, or pushing pregnant women down stairs and then riding on their backs as if they were meaty, malformed skateboards.

I shared a potential reason why users might be asked if they want children—to discern values. I then provided an example as to how that could influence one’s cuddling partners, with the example being based upon my own thoughts and opinions.

I don’t see why this should result in inquiries into my family life from a user who is, according to photographic evidence, two babies from a monochrome realm of hideous mawkishness. Or being told that I’m lacking in tolerance.

pmvines

I do see a lack of tolerance for an opposing viewpoint . The reason i say this is an observation of the comments that you have made about your personal perception of someone who has or wants children. It does seem meant to provoke and does seem to lack tolerance. And this is not coming from a place of criticism for your stance on children but rather from how you express it in a manner that is belittling to one who does not feel the same. I honor your right to have your opinion and share it, however you cannot expect the way you express it to not invite contention. You cant have it both ways.

hogboblin

@pmvines

Wait. So, I should be totally fine interacting with a person who I fundamentally disagree with when it comes to something I see as important?

Man, as a vegetarian, I certainly hope that nobody expects me to tolerate their cooked flesh by eating it. And here I thought it would be tolerant of me to simply say, “No thanks” while refraining from flipping over the table and screaming at the top of my lungs while clawing at the person nearest to me.

Also: I don’t see what was so contentious about what I wrote. I said that “I think creating life is utterly reprehensible.” I didn’t say that “Creating life is utterly reprehensible.” One expresses my own values, the other actively condemns.

If one finds my values to be unpleasant, then...we won’t be cuddling?

I mean, really, I didn’t even go on a rant.

I agree. I am new here and I don’t like such personal questions to be listed on my profile. I am a pro so it allowed me to leave the one about children blank but my relationship status has nothing to do with platonic cuddling, this is feeling like a dating site.

Melancholy

@MichelleW well there is one reason it might be important to know if your pro cuddler is in a relationship...knowing if that person is ok with them doing this job. I heard of a pro who was beaten up by her boyfriend when he found out she was cuddling with men and didn't tell him. So as a client, I would want to know if there's a boyfriend in the picture and some assurance that he is ok with the cuddling. Even though its platonic, some men are insecure and very jealous

I also recently got nasty text message from an ex bf of a pro cuddler I saw. So yes, it matters

pmvines

@MichelleW i can def see your point where from a business asoect it certainly makes no difference.

pmvines

@hogboblin i was actually agreeing with you and defending your right to your opinion. As i said, if you go about expressing it in a provocative manner, referring to language and implied attitude, then i have a hard time defending you against somebody taking issue with it.

hogboblin

@pmvines

I thank you for defending me. When they’re at my door with torches and pitchforks in their hands and murder in their hearts, I’ll know that I have at least one ally against those bipedal vermin and their fecund flesh chasms.

(I’m being absurd, and do not mean to offend in any way. Relax! Shhh. Shhhh. It will be okay.)

@pmvines, you're not agreeing with @hogboblin or defending him. And, really... you shouldn't.

Look, suppose he'd said, "I believe having children is a bad thing to do, and so if I ended up cuddling with someone who wanted to have kids (and I didn't know, because this question wasn't on the site), and they told me they intend to do a thing I believe is very, very wrong, I would probably lose a lot of respect for them. Which could be kind of awkward, don't you think?"

You shouldn't say "you lack tolerance" when you mean is "you lack manners." He doesn't lack tolerance—I've known him online for years—but he does lack manners. Can't seem to phrase things diplomatically without an enormous strain.

He has some weird beliefs, which means he has to tolerate a lot of disagreement. He's had a lot of practice at not attacking people either physically or verbally, and he's pretty good at it. But he is consistently rude. Even to people he agrees with, he's rude. I think it comes of seeing humanity as just another bunch of animals: it's difficult to see anything transcendent about skin on meat on bone wandering around talking about how special it is.

Personally, I was raised to see people as more than the physical parts that make them up—but he wasn't, and he doesn't. So he insults everybody (including himself) on the regular. I don't think he even sees it as insulting anymore; talking about people (including himself) as though they're nothing more than walking collections of blood, bones, and meat is the norm for him. In this instance, I don't believe he meant to be nasty. He was just saying, "I believe X is wrong, so I'd like to know whether the person I'm cuddling with does X/intends to do X, and so I think this question isn't a bad one to have."

Nothing wrong with that, of course! But the way he talks is offensive—it's always offensive—and there's nothing wrong with you taking offense. In fact, it would be odd if you didn't. Just... be clear about the problem?

There's no point in saying "I hope one day you will learn to have tolerance on this matter" to someone who has plenty of tolerance.

pmvines

I disagree but you are entitled to do as you wish. Saying that because you have faced intolerance for something doesn't mean you yourself are not capable of intolerance. It is not about the idea or opinion being expressed but the words being used and the purposeful selection of language to be provocative. Regardless I don't see a need to continue hashing it out. Only so many hairs can be split. I will agree to disagree.

@pmvines, you disagree... with what? Something I'm doing, apparently....

I'm cleaning my kitchen.

Edit: Oh, I see. No, he has weird beliefs and, therefore, has to tolerate the markedly different beliefs of everyone else. Even if he says nothing, the beliefs he doesn't share are all around him and people are constantly acting on them, giving him a lot to tolerate. So he gets a lot of practice.

Secondly, he doesn't purposefully pick words and turns of phrase that'll offend people. That comes naturally, because his beliefs are so different from everyone else's. His natural turns of phrase are offensive to most.

hogboblin

@DarrenWalker

Aw. I don’t know whether to blush, or to go outside and sit in the middle of the road. ☺️

@hogboblin: The two are not mutually exclusive.

I'd like to see that blush, though. Maybe one of these days, assuming you don't sit in the middle of too many roads before we meet.

Mark

All I will say is, as someone who browses a childless-by-choice forum, the comment "I think that creating life is utterly reprehensible" is a view that is completely foreign to me.

@Mark: Isn't it? It's amazing how many strange, yet well-reasoned beliefs there are in the world. Shift a premise or two, and you might as well be talking to an alien. It's fascinating.

This particular idea was an especially foreign one to me. Initially I thought the whole "no one should have kids" thing was just plain cuckoo, but it turns out there's a perfectly follow-able line of reasoning behind it. I love it when that happens, it's like solving an especially insane puzzle. Admittedly, reading Thomas Ligotti's Conspiracy Against the Human Race helped a great deal. It still took some work, though! It's not like I was cheating!

...Okay, so looking at the premises instead of trying to work them all out based on the conclusion is cheating. But it was such an alien idea; I needed the help.

And I read loads of sci-fi and fantasy, too—it's not like I'm unfamiliar with wildly alternative moral systems. I'd never run across this one before, though. If I were an author, I might stick in a race that's completely against reproduction, just for the fun of it. A minor background species, maybe? Or a very long-lived one. Like elves!

Antinatalist elves. That'd be fun to play with.

alexb2

I agree with the OP, i think that is the kind of question you would ask on a dating site, rather than a cuddling site.