I once worked with a young cis woman who had a habit of telling people she wasn't trans even before they asked.
She did this because she'd been asked so many times she knew the question was coming. At nearly six feet tall, with broad shoulders, slim hips, a square jaw, and smallish breasts, she still plans on marrying a cis man and giving birth to children. Why not? After all, she is a straight cis woman. Her private parts are entirely female.
On a site like this, I would tell her, she doesn't need to tell anyone what her private parts look like if she'd rather keep them private. Nobody's going to be going there (or at least they'd better not be), so no expectations will be confounded in this area. But it would be a bad idea, I would say, for her not to mention what she looks like. Yes, she's a cis woman! But the natural assumption—and it is annoying that this is natural—the natural assumption is that a cis woman doesn't look like her.
I don't think anyone on this site needs to tell anybody what they've got in their pants unless they know it might do a bit of "reaching out," so to speak. But they should be straightforward about their body type.
And if they're not? That's not following site rules, and it's wrong.
And if their prospective buddy is so upset by this that they verbally attack them online? That's rude, and it's also wrong.
One of the things about human interaction: There's always plenty of "wrong" to go around. Wouldn't it be nice if one person messing up meant everybody else was suddenly, miraculously, perfectly right?
I don't agree that anyone should be attacked online at all. It's hurtful , toxic , and possibly dangerous if this person's identity was somehow unveiled to the world it could potentially put them in real life risk.
That all being said I do believe because of everything I said above that you're playing a dangerous game by not disclosing if you're indeed a trans person. Clearly it matters very much to some. And quite frankly if anyone wants to cuddle with a cis male or cis female why is that bad thing if that's their preference ? And yes I do consider it a form of deception if you don't disclose what's in your pants & in some circles it could be argued you took away that person's consent to choose by not being straightforward with them.
Except you just said it could be dangerous for them.
That guy wouldve come screaming to the forums outing her if she said it before anyway. The slurs he threw around show that.
I cuddled young lady who didn't tell me she was trans. I kinda thought so when we talked on phone. Nothing in the cuddle session lead me to believe either way. I asked her later on a second phone call. All good but I told her she may want to tell her cuddle buddy before hand the next time. Someone might not take it to well. Maybe felt like being lied to.
While i do understand what you are saying, it is simply stated and direct. I do however think there is a lot more to it than what privates look like, to me. I feel in these instances we want to be able to believe our eyes. We know beliefs are central to how people make choices and conduct themselves. So if what i see i cannot believe, in this type of interaction, I’ll feel betrayed. I would find it troubling to discover i was having certain physical interactions with a human being with, or formerly with, a penis. That may be my issue to contend with but the other human being also owns part of this dynamic.
I’d love to say everyone should be allowed to be who they are because they should. But somethings one person believes others don’t. What a portion of the world has come to except some just haven’t, and may never be able to understand.
I’d like to say that i would be almost as troubled if i was having intimate conversations on the phone or internet with some one i believed to be one type only to discover something else. I don’t want to indict every person that finds themself in this position, I’m glad i haven’t (to my knowledge), but i should be afforded my right to belief.
Pardon my ignorance, but all this mention of Cis male and female, does Cis stand for born biologically fully male or fully female?
Transgender is someone who feels they are born in the wrong body and do what they can to become the gender they feel they were meant to be?
While browsing through profiles on here, i only saw once, a Female Pro Cuddler mention she was a Cis female, and wasnt sure what she meant by that.
Thanks for any clarifications on these terms.
Yes @dharma1257 It means born biological male or female.
I believe it’s more specific than that. I believe it is being the gender you were assigned at birth. To me that’s simply biologically, but I’ve heard explanations that there is more to it.
Why not just have an area in Gender to specify this? That would solve all this. Nobody wants to be deceived or suspect anything even when they don't mean any harm. Not everyone is understanding and just because you feel like you're born in the wrong body not everybody will understand or accept that when you put down you're an "insert gender" but were born something else.
@Kense-web browsers may be different, but in mine there are 19 different listed possibilities in the "other" category for genders.
cis- and trans- mean "same" and "opposite" but I'm told many people are born somewhere in the middle. The Olympics organisation has a lot of headache with it.
I identify as a blackbear. I want winter off, full pay and benefits of course
Careful crusader, people on this forum will take you literally.
@BashfulLoner says, "I feel in these instances we want to be able to believe our eyes."
When a person tells you "I'm a woman" without specifying what type of woman (trans or cis), you can believe that they have a feminine personality and play female social roles: that is, they're a woman. And when your eyes tell you that the visible parts of their body look stereotypically male, you can believe that, too.
What you can't rationally do is assume that their privates match their body type. The odds are high, yes. But that isn't always the case, so you shouldn't come to any solid conclusions.
@dharma1257 and @hugonehugall: "Cis" means that your gender matches the sex/gender you were assigned at birth.
For instance, an person born with a penis is traditionally assigned male, meaning people refer to them as "he" and "him," and teach them to dress and act and get along in society in a stereotypically male way. If he feels comfortable with that, he's cis. If she feels horribly uncomfortable with that, she may be trans... and if xe just feels really weird about it, xe may be agender (that is, not cis).
So what happens when an intersex baby gets their penis removed at birth, gets assigned female, and is fine with it? Is she cis? That, I'm not sure about.
@Kense: I'd be cool with telling people my gender (I did that already, right?) but I'm a little iffy about making my privates public.
Who cares what's going on between my legs? You're not gonna touch it, it is not gonna touch you. I figure the only thing people need to know is my body type: I'm short, skinny, my hips aren't quite as wide as my shoulders, and I stick out a bit front and back (more back than front).
...Well, that and my personality. I'm told I've got an interesting personality.
@Crusader: There's a difference between identifying as a black bear (that is, wanting to have fur and live outdoors and so on) and having, for instance, the brain of a black bear in a human's body. Plus, we don't really have any social roles, stereotypical personality traits, etc. for black bears in human society, which makes things difficult.
@DarrenWalker i support what you are saying, but my eyes may tell me a different story. I also suspect the queer/ non gender conforming human knows what my eyes tell me as well. That’s the struggle
@BashfulLoner: I'm not sure I understand where you're coming from. Your eyes can only tell you what they see, right? And your eyes can't see someone's psyche, or the bits of them that're covered by clothes.
@DarrenWalker my eyes tell me what i perceive to be a woman based on the cues i believe. I am suggesting that those who may not fit in that box know what i see and believe.
I have had acquantance with women that have masculine characteristics and behavior, but when i observe physique, i see female in most instances.
But...what if you’re in a position of power socially, you feel entitled to know what a person’s privates are like, and you feel the need to be catered to specifically because anything else is a vile attack on your personhood and your way of life?
@BashfulLoner: Ohhh. You're having trouble with definitions.
In other words, you see something red and round and think "apple" (and then are ticked when it's a ball). "What," you demand, "can't I believe my eyes?"
You can believe your eyes when they tell you "here is an individual with x human body type." You cannot extrapolate from that to "therefore, they have x private parts." ...Well, not with 100% accuracy, anyway. Not all red, round things are apples—not all people with a certain body type have the private parts you think they do.
So you can believe your eyes... but not necessarily the conclusions you've been trained to draw from your visual observations.
@exsanguinate: ...Unnecessary. See, so far as I can tell, everyone has some kind of desperate need to know what other people's bits look like: it's nothing to do with privilege. Just humanity (probably because we're a bunch of evolved animals).
You’ve seen some of the emotional responses here, right? Of course you have.
@exsanguinate: And I've also interacted with human beings of all genders and sexes online and in real life—it doesn't take social privilege to make people think they deserve to know what's going on in everyone else's pants.
Yes, the people who most vocally complain about what’s in another person’s pants here on CC—they’re a varied bunch.
@exsanguinate: Ah. Now, that is a result of the way cis men are brought up to see pretty much any non-violent contact with another human as sexual, and taught that having any kind of sexual contact with a body that's got a penis on it is unspeakably horrific.
Edit: That's a slightly different conversation to this one, and I've gotta leave for work pretty soon here.
Thoroughly enjoying this conversation.
Perhaps I was a bit too quick to add my snark to your thread. I was going on about what’s common here on CC, what’s perceived as normal, and the majority that throws childish tantrums because they deserve to know what exactly is in a person’s pants despite that not being critical when it comes to platonic cuddling.
Apologies. I got a bit too excited to participate in your thread. Best of luck to you.
@DarrenWalker I'm a little confused about this line.
...they should be straightforward about their body type.
And if they're not? That's not following site rules, and it's wrong.
Is that something you think should be or something that is?
We may not be able to see what is in a person's pants, but a previous poster mentioned feeling a "pokie" from it.
I'd say that if a trans- woman can get an erection, they are definitely too early in the transition process for me.
@geoff1000 Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how did you like the play?
Back in my undergrad days, as a psych major, there was a saying : neurotics build sandcastles in the sky, psychotics live in them.
@DarrenWalker you may not care but others do, including me. If I'm paying for something I want it to be what's being advertised. It doesn't matter if I'll see a package or not. What if that person gets a hard-on and you feel it? It can happen. A Man expecting a woman and feels an unexpected erection may not be so understanding and it could get dangerous for the trans person depending on the reaction. Why even put yourself in that situation. Be honest.
@Kense that reaction alone isn't justification for anything except leaving.