@BotWithFeelings
I'm well versed with LMT doing outcalls. I have one I use.
Their clients are usually seeking something less intimate than crawling into a bed for close contact for an hour + with someone they have never met before.
Like I said, charge what you want.
Man, I miss massages I just want this pandemic to go away.
Massage therapists' clients crawl into bed (usually naked) and ask the therapist to put their hands all over their body (privates excluded). Sounds pretty intimate to me.
And unless they are regular clients, they walk in as complete strangers.
To be fair, even female RMTs deal with inappropriate behavior on the job (guys requesting happy endings, etc). Give some people an inch and they'll automatically assume you're good for the mile. I've always tipped RMTs well. I'm glad I don't have to deal with that in my line of work
As a pro on this site, I take it upon myself to learn about cuddle therapy and become better for each and every cuddle buddy. There is a bit of information out there about how to cuddle in a therapeutic way that brings healing and calmness. But it is a new industry and each person is different. We learn as we go
Envie seriously told it how it is. Thank you
I think some people just don't understand how dangerous this kind of thing can be for women. But hey, we can all learn from each other in the forums.
I didn't know it was so dangerous for them until I heard the stories and read the statistics.
@sunnysideup It really is!! Thank you so much for taking the time to read up on it. The more we all know, the more we can help each other.
@squeakytoy : your last post made laugh out loud..
Happy endings - “giving an inch” - “tip”ped the RMT 😂😂😂😂
@TheGMan You would point this out. Damn it. I only saw the double meanings now.
@squeakytoy - I hate the term "happy ending". Who came up with that?
@Mike403 I can't believe I googled this. Apparently you can blame a magazine called Weekend Australian for coining the term in an article in 1999 (according to Dictionary.com and a stack exchange question):
‘We are seeing more and more women accompanying their men in here,’ she says of her parlour, which provides ‘massage only’ but with a guaranteed ‘happy ending’.
@Envie I'm sorry that you and some of the other professionals here have to repeatedly justify your prices, or the fact that you charge at all. You do really valuable work.
^!
@Tazman5307 ~ Fyi... Saw that a non-pro said you were coming off as, "passive aggressive" toward "Pros", but I don't see it. I feel like you've raised an important topic and have been measured in your replies...🤷♀️ which means mine may just set the entire group on edge... but here goes...
[adding @Mark too]
I too am concerned about the lack of training, certification, qualifications, etc! But even more so I'm worried by the complete lack of a system that would not only provide for more safety, but would rapidly weed out the majority of those who are predators and scammers.
I don't know if requiring such things would then carry some sort of legal implications for CC, or if they could be found liable should a problem arise, but it does seem that some bare minimums could be put into place (as well as changes in designation) to make things better for all involved.
Three steps towards elevating the practice of paid cuddling while enhancing the integrity of the site and the safety of it's users.
Step 1 Removal of the term "Pro" from the current CC lexicon/Redefining the term "Pro"
• One shouldn't be referred to as a "Pro" just because they are "Paid" (it's misleading and sets people up to have a false sense of security/trust and over-inflates the perception of those who haven't earned it) Instead, the term "Paid Cuddler" with the initials "PC" on their profile pic should be adopted. • What it might takes to become an actual "Pro"/"Professional" cuddler outlined below (see #2a and combine with #3 below)
Step 2 Work on further developing an intentional culture of safety, respect, and reasonable expectations ~ A multi-pronged approach:
2.a.) for Paid Cuddlers ~ • Add a nominal application fee • ID required / Sign in with Google type of deal • Photo on file • Credit card/or Paypal type of deal on file • Cuddling 101 overview required - with a multiple guess exam at the end (basic/based on the rules they're expected to follow)
• *2.a.i.) While their application is pending ~ ••Direct to a tab that is specifically for Paid Cuddlers posting about opportunities related to furthering their education/growth in the field including: ••• Workshops, webinars, books, websites, videos, etc. ••• Safety ~ Best practices ••• Taxes/Paperwork ••• Marketing themselves effectively through CC •••• Profile do's and don'ts, Soliciting clients, etc. •• Becoming a "Pro"/Professional cuddler (criteria tbd - see #3 below)
2.b.) for Clients ~ • ID required / Sign in with Google type of deal x• Photo on file • Credit card/or Paypal type of deal on file • Client Expectations 101 (based on the Client Code of Conduct/TOS) with a multiple guess exam at the end. • Provided resources to safety and a summary of what to expect / what's expected of them
2.c.) Payment protection • Establish a system of payment that protects both parties. (can still pay in cash, however clients are required to submit a credit card to "hold" the funds until one hour past the appointment time.)
• Upon meeting, both parties open their apps/CC site, and click, "approve transaction" or "paid in cash".
• If the Client doesn't call and doesn't show up within 15 minutes of agreed upon time, the Paid Cuddler can select - "no call/no showed" - and collect 50% of the agreed session fee (15% of which still goes to CC) and can leave negative karma.
• If the Paid Cuddler doesn't call and doesn't show up within 15 minutes of the agreed upon time, the client selects "no call/no showed", the hold is released, and they can leave negative karma or file a complaint should they choose to.
• If one doesn't want to be charged a fee, be reported, or receive negative karma, they would be advised to not only inform the other they're canceling (within a tdb time frame ~ 6 hours?) Or are running late (within 30 mins of agreed upon time?) through whatever communication means they've been using, but to document it with a message through here as well.
Step 3 Going from "Paid Cuddler" to a "CC Pro"
Developing a system of vetting, supporting, and training "Paid Cuddlers" who would like to go "Pro" / become legitimate Professional cuddlers, should be developed (I'd be happy to serve on such a committee and I'm sure many others here would too). Consideration of grandfathering in those who are currently Pros and meet certain criteria (tbd what that would be / another job for the committee)
Upon completion...
• "CCP" replaces "PC" on their profile pic (maybe even make it gold &/sparkly?)
• Are featured on a special tab, on the home page, or some other place within the site, to advertise them as, "CC Professional" cuddlers
• Are given access to a "CCP Only" tab for whatever they see fit to discuss on it.
Note: These are just my opinions/suggestions, and though I do feel strongly about them, I doubt they are new proposals or that they will result in any changes being made... but there they are anyway... no need to debate the finer points ~ It's really just an outline for starting the conversation toward making things better for all.
@quixotic_life that sounds like some pretty good ideas!
If you look up the definition of the word "professional", it only means that they get paid for it...not that they are any good at it.
I just saw a non - owner of the site asking if (in general) assuming liability for peoples actions would carry some sort of legal implications for cc (as well as giving suggestions on systems that should be in place for accountability), they’ve asked this before & the answer continues to be yes... for purpose of reference let’s take Twitter for example ... Twitter has rules the same way CC has rules , they enforce their rules as does CC ... Twitter is a platform , the same way CC is a platform ... if Twitter was to be liable for the things that are said / shared / or happens , they will open themselves up to lots of legal implications, Same way as CC, If CC was to be liable for peoples actions , same would happen ... Twitter will cease to exist the moment they are required to do so, & ect ect ect ect.
Wow. This topic, thst I started, took off! @quixotic_life ...thank you for the kind words!!
Um...? I didn't specify what they might be held liable for...
But I did mention it in a purposefully vague way, because my rationale for them not having already done some of the things I was suggesting, is there may be potential risks associated with doing some of them.
However, the lack of implementation could also be related to the cost, the capabilities of the platform to handle said change, etc.
addition: Just wondering...
@introvme ~ "I just saw a non - owner of the site asking if (in general) assuming liability for peoples actions would carry some sort of legal implications for cc (as well as giving suggestions on systems that should be in place for accountability), they’ve asked this before & the answer continues to be yes..."
Where did you see this?
That too, & people (many of them) complain about prices as it is , just imagine the overall cost for all those systems being in place & now add the fees & taxation suggested above ... (taxing is a whole argument on its own - can’t believe that was even brought up or suggested ) but yes.
& @ the edit asking , “where did you see this” it was a thread that was taken down & somewhere else but if I come across it I will show you, is this to say that in your mind you didn’t ask before or that you don’t remember?
I'm not sure where the CuddleComfort site is hosted, but FOSTA-SESTA is still a thing in the states, right? I've always assumed that's one of the reasons CC bans people so fast when there's evidence that someone's trying to use the site for sex work. It would suck for CC to be held liable for that. I don't know what other third-party actions websites can be held liable for.
@squeakytoy - Platonic cuddling is a niche and strange activity that has stigmas surrounding it. I don't think they want people to think that this is just another sex site.
I find it a bit odd that this site allows anyone to become a "professional" cuddler with no vetting. It has made me wonder what I'd get from a paid cuddler that I wouldn't get from anyone who would just want to cuddle with someone for free? I think most people enjoy cuddling, but if I'm paying someone with the title of "professional", I'd tend to think they have some knowledge or experience that could lend to a great experience. If I go to a professional massage therapist, for instance, I'd think they would have some knowledge and training (that I wouldn't necessarily have) about how to massage to get the best results. Similarly, I'd wonder if a professional cuddler has some knowledge/training/experience that could help make for a great(er) cuddling experience. Or at least a professionalism that is above what could be expected from a non-pro.
I've heard of books & research on cuddling, which admittedly many people would have free access to, but it shows there are things that can be learned about cuddling that one might not necessarily know. I've also heard of professional cuddling companies that provide training & workshops so their employees have some level of training on appropriate behavior and cuddling techniques.
There are only 2 professional cuddlers I've talked to, and I've had sessions with both - One in person and one as an online video session. I think both were great experiences, and they're probably the only 2 professional cuddlers I most trust right now (one actually owns her own company, and I'd trust others from her company too). I've seen professional cuddlers on here who have viewed my profile but have not messaged me - I suppose people can view someone's profile for any reason, but I'd think professional cuddlers would want to reach out to potentially bring in new clients (unless the client is in another place where they never travel to).
@quixotic_life I think those are good ideas.
@FlyingToaster - Men have a hard time finding a cuddle for free. Pros are more likely to respond. That's why.
@Tazman5307 ~ Sure thing!!
@BotWithFeelings ~ Thank you!!
@Mike403 ~ I've seen others say the same thing... but just because Miriam Webster doesn't define the nuanced meaning of a word, doesn't mean that we don't know full well what inferences one might draw by seeing said word used.
In our society, "Professional", implies one has done something to have achieve this status and are there by qualified to do what they are claiming to be "Professionsls" of, and to be compensated for doing so.
I think it cheapens a lot of what some of the women, and potentially others here, are doing in that they are clearly passionate about what they do, meeting the platonic needs of the clients they serve, see this as a business and are keeping engaged/furthering their growth. To have someone just click a button and "poof" they're a "Pro" too, IMO would feel like an insult.
But even if it's not...
@creedhands put it really well in his analogy about Pro Painters, in how it's misleading and people are unaware until after the fact. That's the same as here.
I've shared this as a caution before (and it's my reason for advocating for a change to the current practices/use of "Pro")...
I had a very negative experience with an enthusiast who then became a Pro here (it was within a day or two). This person only had to click a button, pay his fee and can now call himself a "Pro".
Maybe I was like a, "final conquest" for him, but even if the behaviors he displayed with me, were never done by him again... He's still not a professional!
Just implementing the financial pieces alone would eliminate the ways he shared that he, and others, skirt the percentage system and how CC misses out on their cut... all the time.
That's not professional and it's not ethical either.
Also ~ I'm not suggesting there wouldn't be people you can hire for cuddles. Just that they be called what they are, when they aren't a true professional... and that's a "Paid Cuddler" 💁♀️
@Mike403 I've actually had conversations with more enthusiasts on here than professional cuddlers. Most of those I've talked to are in other states though.
@FlyingToaster - Me too...if the forums count. I've never cuddled an enthusiast.