Safe haven for political enthusiasts (all welcome but plz refrain from clicking if not for you) 📚

cuddles_ndreamcuddles_ndream
edited January 2021 in General

It was good to see a political thread yesterday, and even better to see how everyone remained cordial and respectful before things took an unfortunate turn (could have been handled better by all of us ...

Someone mentioned they love politics which I do as well and many of us do, someone else pointed out that there are people here who have opposing views which is more than true , and lastly someone made the excellent point that there is no harm in sharing differences as long as we remain respectful & civil with one another.

I made sure to read all the the rules to make sure I’m not breaking any with this post, & also was very careful with the title to send the message that there is no baiting / no harm / & nothing more than a few enthusiasts that share this interest in common (plz remain respectful while sharing your views & position, they are welcomed 🌌)

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Comments

  • cuddles_ndreamcuddles_ndream

    When it comes to our 2 party system (by majority), I don’t have a connection with either the Democratic Party or Republican Party ... both parties have values & priorities I identify with, so more than often what attracts me to a candidate is their own personal values / mission & track record ... I wasn’t thrilled when the new commander in chief was elected ... even though it was “the better” option ... I guess I don’t like to settle, and I’m not disappointed either at the new elected person, I’m more disappointed at the working class, who hold the voting power & continue to give it away election after election... it is my personal opinion that there has never (in the history of the United States ) been a stronger ally to the working class than Bernie Sanders ... the one candidate that refuses lobbying/ the one candidate that is outspoken & fights / but somehow is overlooked due primarily because of the media / which is owned by special interest/ & they fail to this day to make the connection.

  • [Deleted User]lets_cuddlee (deleted user)

    As much as I like Bernie Sanders' views, he's never struck me as a "fighter." The democrats stole the primaries from him twice, and he just....let them. And then supported them. To me, he talks a good game, but he's more of a wimp, than anything. I'm a Trump supporter, and I can still confidently acknowledge that Bernie Sanders got a raw deal and probably would have been an ok president. I think Tulsi has more of a backbone, though. She impresses me.

  • cuddles_ndreamcuddles_ndream

    @lets_cuddlee The first time I thought (you must be kidding me) !! 😯 ... than I’m like ok, he took the gentleman route to not divide the party so that Hilary could get the best chances at winning (& still lost 🤦‍♂️) And when it happend the 2nd time 😤 I don’t think there was anyone more upset in this planet than me ... I was very mad at him & I got turned away from politics ... your points at 💯!! I feel the dnc didn’t want him & made sure if it, he would go wayyy too much against the grain , & stand up to the people “he shouldn’t” ... I wish he would have run regardless if he was chosen in the primaries or not (which he didn’t) but I know for fact that if he chose to run independent the democrats would have lost because he would have taken too many votes away - today I like to think that he did it for a greater cause than himself, even though I’m still highly disappointed (heck I wrote him in the 2 times) great argument!

  • [Deleted User]lets_cuddlee (deleted user)

    @introvme

    Agreed. The DNC did not want him in there. I'm very sure he would have beat Trump in 2016. You might be interested to hear that a lot of Bernie supporters voted for Trump in 2016 for no other reason than to spite Hillary and the DNC, only to find out that Trump and Sanders have a lot more in common than one might initially suspect. I think, as far as policy, Bernie is more like Trump than any of the other corporate DNC sell-outs (aside from Tulsi.)

  • [Deleted User]squeakytoy (deleted user)

    @lets_cuddlee How are Bernie and Trump alike?

  • parkwayvisualparkwayvisual
    edited January 2021

    @squeakytoy .......I don't fully agree with Bernie's stand on the issues, but I feel he's fundamentally a decent person with our nations best interests at heart (even if I don't fully agree with his route to get there). Basically, a complete 180 of Donny.

  • [Deleted User]squeakytoy (deleted user)

    @spuds I agree with you. I was just curious about how they might be considered similar because every time I hear Bernie speak about Donny it's to say something absolutely damning :joy: I've always seen them as polar opposites of each other.

  • [Deleted User]squeakytoy (deleted user)

    It makes me think of his reaction to the Biden vs Trump debate (which I thought was amazing):

  • Rocket_ManRocket_Man

    Sorry to see we are going down this road again. Regardless of where you stand on this topic or do not care either way there are so many appropriate places to post political threads. Like political message forums. This one is bound to devolve same as the last one did. Now if it asked who is your favorite politician to cuddle with or something maybe it would have some legitimate standing. Also at least 95% of politicians suck. The R vs D dichotomy is just a dog and pony show. George Carlin has some great bits about this.

    .

  • [Deleted User]squeakytoy (deleted user)

    @Invisible_Touch I believe we all agreed to keep it civil here the moment we opened the thread - it's a place for political enthusiasts to talk. There are many threads in the general forums that have nothing to do with cuddling. It's okay if you don't like this thread. There are others.

  • [Deleted User]lets_cuddlee (deleted user)

    @squeakytoy

    Glad you asked. They actually converge on a pretty remarkable number of policy positions, as well as in their rhetoric. For example, they both opposed the TPP, and they both emphasized the need for fair, not free, trade deals, for the American people.

    "We need trade policies that are fair for the American worker, fair for poor people around the world, and not just designed to make the CEOs of multinational corporations even richer than they are today." Bernie Sanders

    "We need fair trade, not free trade. We need fair trade. It’s gotta be fair." Trump.

    At one point, Trump even acknowledged that they were very much in agreement on trade. And they very much are, just with slightly different framings, IMO.

    They both emphasized the effect that immigration has on depressing wages for low-income American workers.

    Anti-interventionist foreign policy, against "endless wars," a phrase both have used quite often.

    I could go on. If you google "Trump Sanders overlap" or anything like that, you'll find plenty more about it. Both candidates were seen by their supporters as "outsiders," etc.

  • [Deleted User]squeakytoy (deleted user)

    @lets_cuddlee Okay, I can see this! That's interesting. I didn't know they agreed on these points and I think I will google to find out more.

  • [Deleted User]Mmart (deleted user)

    This thread has a very useful purpose for those interested. George Carlin was a funny comedian. Please don't confuse comedy with reality.

  • [Deleted User]lets_cuddlee (deleted user)

    @squeakytoy

    For sure! At first, I also thought the comparison a bit ridiculous. But once I put my preconceived notions aside, I had to admit to myself....there's quite a bit that I agree with both of them on! Particularly vis-a-vis establishment politicians, like Hillary, Biden, or, well....most of them, lol.

    Also, both Trump and Bernie refused money from superPACs and large financial donors! Not to mention, they were critical of superPACs and corporate funding. That's why we were able to get bills passed like the Right to Try Act, IMO. Trump didn't owe anything the pharmaceutical companies, because he didn't take any money from them!

    Not to say they didn't have their differences. Of course, they diverged plenty. Which only makes the fact that they have so many similarities that much more interesting, to me! Like, I wonder if they are even aware of it? Lol

  • Rocket_ManRocket_Man

    Yes George Carlin was a comedian. However there was a lot of truth in some of his comedy. In fact many comedians who are successful are sucessful for that very reason.

  • [Deleted User]squeakytoy (deleted user)

    @lets_cuddlee I am always grateful when politicians refuse to be bribed! I was just reading more about the similarities/differences in schools of thought between Sanders and Trump when it comes to helping the working class, and about Sanders-Trump voters in particular. I can't say that my opinion of Trump has changed as a result of what I learned (I can't abide his views on most of the issues I consider important) but it was still some very interesting reading.

  • [Deleted User]lets_cuddlee (deleted user)

    @squeakytoy

    I can dig it. I wasn't trying to change your mind or anything. That ship has sailed, lol.

    I just think they both speak to a similar frustration. I think Trump and his supporters have gotten a bad rap and I just like to point out that, without the media playing divide and conquer, if we focused on our similarities rather than our differences, we could probably do a lot more compromising than fighting.

  • Rocket_ManRocket_Man
    edited January 2021

    Yes that is their strategy and sadly it has worked for a long time to the satisfaction of the oligarchs.

  • [Deleted User]squeakytoy (deleted user)
    edited January 2021

    @lets_cuddlee I would normally agree that people should focus on similarities and try to compromise, if the only issues at hand were about helping the working class, stopping corporations from influencing policy through lobbying and bribery, etc. I'm not loyal to any particular party up here in Canada. I vote based on the candidate and the policies of the party at the time of voting. I also don't follow mainstream American media. Most of my judgements of Trump have been based on his own twitter feed.

    I think there are certain issues and ideologies people should never, in good conscience, compromise on (or preferably even entertain). Some of these include, but are not limited to, support of white supremacy groups, sexually assaulting women, and spreading misinformation to the point of inciting a coup attempt.

    I'm not trying to change your mind either - if you're still a supporter, that ship has certainly sailed, as you put it. We'll have to agree to disagree on our opinions of Trump.

  • sunnysideupsunnysideup

    Impressed by how civil it is so far. Whether you like Trump or hate him, I think him getting in office shows that the people have a mistrust of career politicians and that the system can be shaken up. So if you bleed blue rather than red, then there is hope that another Bernie type should run and can win. What the election also showed us, though, is that Winning these popular votes does require charisma and a magnetic personality, so sincerity/good policies alone is not the only requirement. The most recent election showed us that the people would rather have crappy politics as usual, than to be led by a mold breaker that they believe is leading the country down a darker path.

  • [Deleted User]squeakytoy (deleted user)

    The most recent election showed us that the people would rather have crappy politics as usual, than to be led by a mold breaker that they believe is leading the country down a darker path.

    Agreed. I'm glad we don't have a two-party system up here, for pretty much this reason. I like being able to choose based on having confidence in the candidate's platform and track record. I hate the idea of being forced to vote for a candidate I'm not crazy about just because I consider the other candidate much worse.

    Not saying we've always had at least one good choice even with 4 parties, but... what can you do :sweat_smile:

  • sunnysideupsunnysideup

    @squeakytoy Yeah. I really dislike what happens here: how a public figure or political pundit seems to have their own views on social agenda/economy. Then, when they run for office or are in a position of political authority, those views that made them go against the grain dissolve and they become spokespersons for their party of choice, whether it be democrat or republican. It's like the system is telling us, pick one side, be vocal about it, and you will be rewarded. I don't know haha

  • Plato33Plato33


    Loving all these pics of Bernie!

  • MrPaulMrPaul

    The unfortunate situation is that it doesn’t matter much who is elected. Lobbyists control most of the legislation that gets put into law, as well as the political decisions that are made.

    Take a look at what you get for your money from what I’d call a low cost lobbyist: https://lobbyit.com/pricing/

    After you look at those prices, consider that some lobbyists have plans starting at $50,000 a month. Think about that, and what a top tier plan over $350,000/month will achieve.

  • [Deleted User]squeakytoy (deleted user)

    @MrPaul @sunnysideup : Agreed with both of you. I hate that it seems like so many politicians are either corrupt from the start, or easily corruptible. Voting for a candidate who seems solid is good, but it's absolutely not enough - we still need to keep an eye on them once they're in office, and hold them accountable for their actions.

  • [Deleted User]squeakytoy (deleted user)

    @Plato33 I love the Bernie memes going around too :joy:

  • FlyingToasterFlyingToaster

    Yes George Carlin was a comedian. However there was a lot of truth in some of his comedy. In fact many comedians who are successful are sucessful for that very reason.

    I agree. And I think George Carlin had a knack for pointing things out concisely. I think many things he said were opinion, but I think there was truth to a lot of what he said too.

  • [Deleted User]squeakytoy (deleted user)

    This Bernie mittens thing is only getting better :joy:

  • quixotic_lifequixotic_life

    @squeakytoy ~ That popup chair one is the best!!!

  • snuggleme123snuggleme123

    @lets_cuddlee said...

    “I just like to point out that, without the media playing divide and conquer, if we focused on our similarities rather than our differences, we could probably do a lot more compromising than fighting.”

    Arguably the best post I have read on this site.

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