First Time-Guilt About Secrecy with Spouse

MateoS71MateoS71
in General

I don’t consider cuddling cheating- I feel like this is something I need therapeutically, and my wife simply won’t understand. She doesn’t have the capacity to give me what I need in this area. Our sex life is fine- but she is not into affection if it’s not leading to sex. I think she thinks it’s a waste of time. Anyway. I’m still feeling guilty- maybe because I feel like I can’t tell her. I won’t tell her- as I know she would consider this to be a form of unfaithfulness. Any input would be great.

  1. Does your spouse know you cuddle outside the marriage?121 votes
    1. Yes
      40.50%
    2. No
      59.50%
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Comments

  • CuddleWhoCuddleWho

    This is a tricky situation. On the one hand you would ideally have confronted this issue earlier in your relationship - a partner not being interested in physical affection is going to be a glaring problem for many people, potentially a dealbreaker, and you probably shouldn't have moved forward without figuring out how your needs were going to get met in this relationship.

    But here you are. While I don't feel it's really ethical to cuddle without your wife's knowledge, I do understand. If one partner isn't willing to meet basic and common expectations in a relationship, something is going to break.

  • [Deleted User]WriterGF (deleted user)

    The challenge is you are inevitably going to have to lie to your partner at some point, and remember the lies, and when you get caught, the marriage is probably over.

  • BlissfulHarmonyBlissfulHarmony

    Wow..that's a tough battle. I think you should be honest about your needs and express the seriousness of it. The last thing I would want as a wife is another person experiencing that level of intimacy from my husband and being in a space where I am not reciprocating your needs.

  • [Deleted User]MrAdmirer (deleted user)

    It’s funny how people can have open communication with strangers but not with their own spouse:

    I would consider this emotional cheating. You are assuming she won’t understand , but you will never know because you won’t man up and ask.

  • [Deleted User]Mman (deleted user)

    Sounds like a counseling session with you and your wife is in order. IMO this is an issue that requires professional help. I wish you the best.

  • Blue_eyed_QueenBlue_eyed_Queen

    I can deeply empathize with the OP. There are countless people in relationships lacking affection that come to this site to book a Pro. Speaking from experience. I dont think the decision should be based on the popular vote, as its something deeply personal between you and your wife.

    When I first became a Pro it was at the actual encouragement of my then boyfriend, who was not affectionate. In his words, he "could not give me what I needed". The relationship ended - on good terms - but for this very reason. When I started cuddling, I became happier, and realized what I was missing. I decided I needed more from the relationship and left, but kept cuddling.
    My current partner is in full support of my business, and hes just as affectionate as me! :)

    To wrap up the rambling...this has to be something you can do with a clean conscience. It makes it hard to enjoy, otherwise.

    I find many people jump right to this site as a solution in lieu of having that awkward conversation about their needs with their partner. If you have already had the conversation I totally understand. But, at least give her the chance to meet your needs.

    :-)
    Seriously though....Im rooting for you!

  • SleepySheep1SleepySheep1
    edited June 2023

    "She is not into affection if it’s not leading to sex."
    Have you considered it could be the type of touch? For example maybe stroking the arms is off-putting, but simply spooning without movement is better.

    Sometimes incorporating comfort items, things like a weighted blanket, scalp massager, a body pillow, soft socks, etc. can help.

    Maybe ask what she doesn't like about it specifically? Are there areas you can improve on to be a better cuddler? It can be so many factors- but it shouldn't hurt to ask!

    Edit: Also sometimes it's a time thing, I've dated women in the past who were fine with 15 min bouts of cuddling, but beyond that began erring into suggestive territory, respecting that and stopping when they wanted really helped mediate that we both got what we wanted.
    (Although these days I'm much more fulfilled cuddling the many people I meet on here!)

  • MorpheusMorpheus

    I don’t like being dishonest with my wife. We are in an open relationship. She doesn’t like to hear details. All she really wants to know is who I am with and when and she wants to make sure that whoever I am with, we are treating each other with kindness. I don’t know what advice I have to offer if any. Im sorry that you’re in that situation and I hope you find healing.

  • [Deleted User]WriterGF (deleted user)

    I kind of feel like you have answered your own question -- if you're feeling guilty about something, then some part of you knows it's wrong.

  • HoosCuddlingHoosCuddling

    So the thing about hiding something like this from your spouse...if she ever finds out about it, she may assume that it's worse than it actually is -- she may assume that sexual activities are involved.

    You can say "oh she'll never find out, I can hide it forever" but there's no 100% guarantee of that.

    Be honest with yourself: if your wife found out about your cuddling experiences, would she end the marriage? And is that a risk you want to take, even if it's a small risk?

    I hid something from my wife for many years. When she found out, it blew up our marriage. I should have just been honest with the fact that I wasn't happy, years earlier, instead of trying to hold the marriage together at all costs. That decision brought everyone more heartache. So be careful.

  • CuddleWhoCuddleWho
    edited June 2023

    I would consider this emotional cheating. You are assuming she won’t understand , but you will never know because you won’t man up and ask.

    You know what is about the worst way I can imagine to get a man to listen to your point and give it credence? Tell him to "man up." Questioning someone's manhood is a pretty easy path to getting him angry at you.

    Anyway, while communication is obviously a generally good thing in a relationship, I see no reason to assume this man and his wife haven't talked extensively about the issue of physical affection. And I also see no reason to assume he isn't confident in knowing how she'd feel about him cuddling with others. It's very possible "Hey, would you mind if I cuddle other women" would be as destructive to their marriage as "Hey, would you mind if I have sex with other women".

  • [Deleted User]MrAdmirer (deleted user)

    @CuddleWho there is also no reason to assume they have talked about it. Bottom line is the OP knows he is wrong and is just fishing here in the community to see if he is not alone in his bad behavior. Won't get any sympathy from me.

    I was in a marriage and in the same boat. But I actually had the courage to "man up about it" and have the tough conversation with the spouse about it. She was not sympathetic to any of my needs and refused to let me seek elsewhere. We even tried couples therapy. Low and behold, a couple years later nothing changed and finally we divorced. But I didn't cowardly sneak behind her back.

  • CuddleWhoCuddleWho

    there is also no reason to assume they have talked about it.

    The reason is that they're married and this is an important issue to him that he's been dealing with for a long time, about which he knows his wife's opinion. I would be absolutely flabbergasted if they hadn't talked about this. I mean, have you ever been in a long term relationship where you didn't talk about issues that are important to you?

    Won't get any sympathy from me.

    Fine, this is a reasonable point of view. You think it's unethical to be dishonest with his wife. Makes sense. But, as you discovered in your own experience, trying to ask the wife accomplished nothing but delaying getting your needs met for a couple years as you went through counseling and divorce. The viable options he has are to just accept the lack of affection, to go behind his wife's back, or divorce.

  • [Deleted User]MrAdmirer (deleted user)

    @CuddleWho exactly. He can be a coward or deal with the problem head on. Imagine how she would feel if he kept this from her for a long time and finally found out. This is something you clearly are not considering.

    I’m obviously at a point where I am done with non communication. I know a lot of people stuck in miserable marriages becuase they won’t deal with these problems, even if it leads to divorce. Better than living the lies or in denial.

  • ManOutdoorsManOutdoors

    Wow, there is a ton of name-calling here. We can find kind ways to share our perspectives.

    It sounds like neither situation is ideal which is really difficult. Most people tend to say, just ask your spouse, but a lot of people already know this is unlikely to go well and just asking can change the relationship significantly. It's a really tough position to be in. I wish I had a clear answer for you. All I can say is that I support you and I am glad you are asking yourself the tough questions.

  • [Deleted User]WriterGF (deleted user)

    We love the way we need to be loved. If you aren't getting something you fundamentally need, you can slap a Band-Aid on it by going outside the relationship or address the fundamental question of whether you are compatible as a couple.

    If you have discussed this with your partner, and you know you are doing something she would not be okay with, you are betraying her by lying -- and while your needs are important, respecting your partner's feelings is as well.

    My guess is she's not refusing to cuddle on a whim ...she's not giving it because she doesn't need it and likely never will. If you stay together, you will likely never be happy because either you won't be getting what you want or you will be lying to your partner. Either way, there is a real risk of a break-up sooner or later.

  • [Deleted User]CharlesInWI (deleted user)

    Other people’s relationships are very rarely anyone’s business.

    However, that partners flat don’t communicate with each other is one reason that I am very uncomfortable cuddling someone that is in a relationship, unless I have spoken to all the partners in that relationship.

    Jealous humans that feel betrayed and hurt are always dangerous things.

  • cuddlefaerycuddlefaery
    edited June 2023

    I know I'm generally overly verbose, but I wanted to share a lil bit from a different perspective and food for thought (though I'm sure much of this may already have been considered).

    I'm going to preface this by reiterating what I've mentioned in forums previously:

    I am polyamorous and practice ethical/consensual non-monogamy and have done so for more than 12 years. More over, during that time probably around 50-60% of my partners have been married or cohabitating and earlier on it was a mixed bag of how many of their spouses knew about me or any other partners.

    Now, before someone jumps all over me "but Fae, to that's talking about sex and this is platonic", I'd like to point out that not all relationships are sexual, emotional cheating is a thing, and that people define "cheating" differently.

    What I decided long before I started practicing ENM was that for me, at it's core the dishonesty was the actual betrayal - the intentional breach of trust. Consent, particularly of the "enthusiastic, fully informed" kind preferred by those who practice ENM is not compatible with lying, either by omission or misstatement. When you lie to a partner, however small, they no longer have all the context necessary and so are unable to actually give consent - therefore any actions you take from that point on are nonconsensual even if they agree with you. Manipulators and abusers use lying of all sorts in order to force false "consent" from their victims - but that is coercion.

    When people lie by omission to their partners in order to avoid conflict, they are on fact manipulating their partners into tacit consent by coercion even if that is not the intent. You can be purely trying to "protect" your partner, but that does not change the fact that you are manipulating another person in order to get what you want or think you need.

    .

    Sometimes it comes down to miscommunication or misunderstanding - a person assumes their partner would never agree so they never even bring it up.

    Sometimes it has been discussed and there is an impasse, and the lying begins to avoid further conflict.

    Ultimately this is how I consider it: is my need for (insert activity) greater than my need for having this partner in my life?

    Because I choose not to treat people I love unethically by denying them autonomy and consent, I will not lie to them.

    Thankfully because I am polyamorous and practice ENM, all of my partners equally respect my autonomy and we all freely discuss consent and negotiate agreements where necessary - but I am never restricted or vetoed from doing something, only given choices. For folks who are monogamous it may be a bit more tricky to navigate if their partner is not on board after multiple discussions....and this is where couple's therapy can really help. If there is miscommunication or misunderstanding happening, couple's therapy can help both partners better communicate with each other and see the other's point of view. It could be your need is not fully coming across to your partner, or perhaps your partner may be willing if they had language to better express their boundaries and needs that would help them feel more secure.

    But also sometimes people's needs just are not compatible, as painful as that can be no matter the length of the relationship. And again the question becomes: do I need (cuddling) more than I need my partner? Solo therapy can help here, as well. And ultimately hard choices might have to be made. But I can say from experience - Don't Ask, Don't Tell arrangements and lies of ommission rarely are as successful as people like to fool themselves into believing. Partners almost always know something is up, and the less willing partner who has been coerced almost always ends up resentful, hurt, and frustrated. But personally, for me, lying to a partner even by ommission is never an option because it breaks a very core tenet of my belief system against someone I love - that every human has autonomy and the right to give consent over that which impacts them. I would rather end an incompatible relationship than force someone I love by coercion into doing something that I need against their will if I cannot get them to agree to do so freely.🤷🏻‍♀️

    Tl;Dr: consent requires being fully informed, so by lying by omission to your spouse/partner to avoid confrontation means you remove their ability to consent. Navigating conflicting needs in a relationship is hard, and sometimes professional help is warranted - and sometimes it's just pure incompatibility.

    As pertains to cuddle partners and clients - as I said previously, I have had partners in difficult relationship situations, heck - I've been in them myself. I do not judge unless intentional harm is being done to someone. However, I also will not go against my own ethics so I ask my cuddle partners not to put me in the situation of being part of their deception. If hiding cuddling is how they feel they must deal with their current situation, I'm happy to be a friend and support them in other ways - but I will not knowingly help them lie to their partner(s) even by ommission. It's one of my fairly hard boundaries in life in general, so it translates into my platonic and business practices as well.

  • ManOutdoorsManOutdoors

    Thank you for your post cuddlefaery. This is the best description of this perspective that I have ever read. It really illustrates the difficulty of disagreement in any relationship and how they can be handled.

  • PrettyLuvPrettyLuv

    @WiserGuy3000 very wise words here & I hope OP reads your post a couple times to see the fruition of what omission can yield.

    @cuddlefaery you touched on a caveat that many would prefer to keep grey for their own advantage, but I like how you framed omission as a source of non-consent. The old adage ‘out of sight, out of mind’, ‘what you don’t know can’t hurt you’ becomes its own source of deceit not just against one’s partner but to oneself. Deceiving oneself into believing no harm done to your partner when the creeping fissures of division & separation/loneliness are already taking root as a result, forming well developed cracks in what may have once been an otherwise solid foundation. I, like you, agree, transparency is of utmost importance and a form of respect not just in regards to your partner but for yourself here as well.

    Marriage is a bond but also a signed agreement between two people to do whatever is necessary to uphold it. If cuddling is the only thing potentially holding it apart, I think it’s imperative you let her know to what degree. In other words, put the cards on the table & let her know where you stand with respect to them. If she wants to stay in the marriage as much as you do, you’ll see it in her actions towards you following. If she’s prepared to walk away, you’ll see this as well. But omission on either end of one’s needs will just prolong the separation & silence between, breaking whatever you were trying to hold by omission in the first place.

  • pmvinespmvines
    edited June 2023

    Of course you are feeling guilt,.because dishonesty through justification of you not getting what you want out of something is something you are supposed to feel guilty about. Lying to your partner and going behind their back to do something they would be hurt by is supposed to make you feel guilty, unless you have sociopathic tendencies, in which case you might rationalize it as a means to an end to meet your own needs, regardless of your partner and how it might impact them and your relationship as a whole, which is what so many people on here do which In truth isn't anything short of being selfish. You feel guilt because if your partner were to find out that if you are meeting interwebs strangers in hotels for close physical contact in what amounts to pajamas and quite possibly even paying them to do so , then yes, they will likely be hurt by it . So to avoid this you can either be honest and see if they agree to let you do it , not do it and work on your relationship and the hand that you are dealt, or end the relationship altogether. Otherwise, stop scratching your head about why you would feel guilty about this.

  • KatotaKatota

    It’s funny how people can have open communication with strangers but not with their own spouse

    @MrAdmirer Lol! You're not the only one to find the humor in that.😁

  • SammyG_SammyG_

    Probably not a good idea to come ask complete internet strangers advice for your marriage. But since you did, let me join the underinformed counselors and weigh in and say don’t tell your spouse.

  • MrMarkAndrewMrMarkAndrew
    edited June 2023

    If you have to ask, well…yeah, it’s pretty much cheating if you don’t tell your significant other.

  • JaneDough_JaneDough_

    @CuddleWho @WriterGF @MrAdmirer @BlissfulHarmony @cuddlefaery 💛 you all made me very happy.

  • palmbch02palmbch02

    This is a very interesting thread. June 1, I found out my husband was cuddling another woman in his hotel room in another city. The betrayal I felt hurt like nothing else I have ever experienced. I couldn’t sleep, breathe, live. He can home the next day and we talked. I couldn’t get the image of him with another woman out of my head, even if he did keep reiterating how it was strictly platonic over and over again. I could t think straight and spend the day in a fog just crying and feeling the lowest of lows. Then June 3, through a message that came through on his phone I found out about the other 6 times he had a ‘cuddle session’ with women from this site. I felt the lowest of lows. The hurt was more intense than anything else I have ever felt. Not only were there lies but the thought of him sharing that intimate space in a bed with other women was beyond imaginable to me. Please I’m begging you, don’t do this to her. This pain could have been prevented by just being open and communicating. If it ends then it ends correctly, but don’t go behind her back.

  • robroorobroo

    @palmbch02 questions that make me go hmmmm:
    1. You say your husband was cuddling " another woman" suggests you are a woman but your profile says you're a man?
    2. So you signed up for a cuddling site just to respond to a specific topic in the forums or are you here to find a cuddling partner?

  • palmbch02palmbch02
    edited June 2023

    I am a woman who wanted to see the women her husband was cuddling. Yes I signed up for this site strictly to try to find more info about his lies. Then I found the forums and behold a thread that seemed to match exactly what I have experienced. When you feel betrayal and find information like this, myself at least, feel the need to dig and find more info to try to understand the how and why’s and what I missed.

  • palmbch02palmbch02
    edited June 2023

    I did make contact with one of the women - it was the one who randomly sent him a text just to say hello and see if he wanted another session. I was able to talk with her and explain what was now happening. She didn’t even know he was married and is now dealing with her own level of guilt and feelings towards this.

  • Matt462Matt462

    @palmbch02 , I’m sorry you had to go through that. If I could give some advice though, don’t make yourself crazy over it, it’ll take some time to heal but we all deserve honesty and trust in a relationship.

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