Either way, I have immense compassion for men. I want to understand them and what they need, beyond the ‘bandaid’. I recently offered my services in a queer publication. Feeling nervous as to not bring my own bullshit into the service. But I am hopeful to pivot my practice to people who are actually seeking healing, as I can no longer sustain my wellbeing working with men unless they are respectful of the amount of work I’ve endured up to this point. All they see is access. They don’t see the wisdom. And they don’t value it.
If you talk to any women who has modeled, bartended, danced, cuddled, offered companionship, offered massage, offered intimacy coaching etc etc or any person centered service you will find so much crossover in lue of boundary crossing. The service hardly matters.
Unfortunately, very true. I’m a photographer and the amount of horror stories I’ve heard from female models, along with the cringey behavior of many male photographers, it’s all very disgusting and sad.
@cuddlefaery I love your analogy of sneezing. That's perfect and you are 100000% correct. There is no excuse.
Speaking of no excuse, as a man who grew up in the 70's and 80's, I did see that conquer women lesson that you spoke of. But I also saw respect women lesson out there too. Respect everyone. The right lessons have always been there.
I know that I made the choice to do as little harm as possible in that regard. But why did I make that choice and others, so many others, didn't?
I wish it was safe here for me to really explain what the male experience is for many of us. Not to let anyone off the hook, it's never ok to 'sneeze' on anyone. Never. But there is so much going on that isn't being talked about, that isn't being understood. And I brought this forum to my therapist a while back, and she said that I was right. I could be hurt if I spoke of such things here. I have been, in the past, not just here but pretty much everywhere outside of the therapy office.
It's a cruel world. There's a lot of beauty too. It's so frustrating and heartbreaking.
But this is the best thread I've read here in a long long time. Thank you to those who have participated so openly and sincerely. I hope everyone gets more of the love and care that they are looking for. And respect.
@quincyq03 It certainly is, and things could definitely get dark thinking and talking about it.
I really don’t want this to turn into a man hating forum, I know there are a lot of amazing men on here, pros, clients, and enthusiasts alike, who are carrying the weight with me.
@billiam I responded to your message. Honored that this post is touching on some very real and important issues. I’ll definitely be speaking with my therapist as well 😅
@SweetCuddler33 thank you so much for your kind words
@TeaBabe
I’ll send you a pm.
Until we change the culture to stop teaching males from birth that women’s bodies are either 1. a potential sex object they’re entitled to take regardless of what the woman wants (whether or not they’re considered “wife material” by said man), or 2. useless trash, this problem will never go away.
Nothing women do can completely prevent this because these encounters are unequal (watch an MMA match between a heavyweight and a welterweight and see how that goes for the latter), and the problem is always solely belonging to the person doing the harming to choose not to harm, not the targets of harm.
We live in a society where rape is already illegal and the consequences are supposed to be severe. Predators DGAF. This crime has by far the lowest report and prosecution rates because the crime scene is our body and we’re immersed in rape culture where even a judge blames the wrong person and they “don’t want to ruin [the perpetrator’s] life” by enforcing the damn law. Brock Turner case, anyone?
I’ve worked as both a police officer in the military and victim advocate in the civilian criminal justice system, and these cases were by far always the most enraging to witness, and honestly make me want to bring back vigilante justice for them. And this is way, way, waaaaaaaay more common than anyone wants to believe. All women know the majority of our women friends have been violated in some way sexually, yet most males claim to not know any rapists. If you legit believe this…you’re probably the rapist. And oh by the way at least 10% of your male friends have in fact committed rape, too.
Good luck finding any way for women alone to fix this when these types of men have no interest in hearing what we have to say or how their behavior affects us, and just dismiss us as shrill, hysterical females. Change happens when MEN speak up, intervene, confront, and live the principles of a non-misogynistic society. This is everyone’s problem to address, not just women’s.
Watch North Country for a small glimpse of what it’s like to be a woman in this world. Predators everywhere emboldened by a culture and system that allows them to act like animals, leaders who scapegoat the victims, women terrified to speak up and lose everything, and a whole ton of passive male bystanders (who think they’re good guys because the bar for men is set so low it’s in hell) staying silent or laughing when they witness women being denigrated, harassed, and abused.
@TeaBabe NEVER apologize for being “you”. Not everyone fits into YOUR puzzle and that’s okay. Find your circle of “people” and call it good. Who’s to say what’s “too small”? Respect is what’s lost on this world anymore. We can’t have differences of opinion and “talk it out” like mature adults because “feelings”.
I wish I could meet you and give you a hug! I hate to say it but I’d “scrub” anything about having anything to do with sex work from your memory when not at work. No one needs to know about that and unfortunately, males ARE going to get the wrong idea.
As a nanny, I cuddle kids all the time, but I didn’t get that as a child so I crave it as an adult. I never knew it was associated with sex until I joined this site. I still cuddle “my” kids, but looking back, my incubator having watched A TON of daytime TV when I was a kid, I can see the association. It’s small mindedness that causes the inability to disconnect the 2 and it’s sad, but I think the association with sex is where the disrespect for boundaries with JUST cuddling stems from.
Brock Turner blamed alcohol. I've been drunk as a dog and never once thought about touching anyone without their permission.
Ok wish you best in future
Looks like you’re active and still around!
Five years would have been less let alone 90 days … After having seen how lives are effected and damaged … its my conviction that the cost of permanently damaging a life should be life in prison
@DarlingNikkii yes I’m here I’ve received some great supports and wanted to continue to connect with the community and I was curious about the discussion. Just taking a big step back from in person clientele because I need to readjust.
@TeaBabe glad to see that you're still around, but also doing what is best for you. I took a big break from professional cuddling and take regular extended breaks from this site in particular. While I'd love to live in a world where full time cuddling were a possibility for me, it's just not feasible right now. Keep taking care of you first and foremost!
As a father of two sons, I’ve made it a point to teach them to always respect others and especially women. To always be aware of how they make others feel, and to never ever cross someone’s personal boundaries.
This is by no means a perfect answer, just my own experience. But one way I encouraged them was with ballroom dance.
It put them in a social but non-romantic situation with women and girls. It taught them how to be a partner, how to communicate, how to lead an how to listen. And most importantly that you can be close, touch, and even be intimate with a woman in an healthy and positive way all while not being romantic or sexual. Definitely not the only factor, but I believe it was crucial in helping them to treat women as equal partners, and not something to be conquered or possessed.
@TichantoP that's an excellent idea, I love to go dancing once a month swing dancing and contra dancing and it's nice to be connected with men in that way. It's kind of like a platonic cuddle.. thank you for helping your boys
I am sorry to hear of your negative experiences. Unfortunately it is a story I have heard from other cuddlers. I am disappointed in many men's behavior. I do not accept the excuse of "society" or "the 70's snd 80's" etc, a man is responsible for his actions toward other people. I am disgusted when I hear that some guys think that paying for cuddling entitles them to extra access to a woman. And I agree with others that you should not feel broken or apologize for your limits. Each cuddling interaction (or any human interaction) is unique to the peiple involved. The guy should be respectful as he should in any normal public interaction. You do not stop being a woman or a human because you agreed to cuddle. Those "men" should be ashamed but I do not believe they know what shame is. I hope they get reported and bounced, it hurts the community. I have had so many good connections with women on this site. Sometime therapy for me, sometimes it seems for them, probably really for both of us. It is nice to feel the safety and kindness if human touch. I hope we can do better. You should never be made to feel exploited, mistreated or disrespected. I am sorry for your experience and I think it is important to know our limits and not doubt ourselves. You sound like you know you and I hope you find that sweet spot. I hope all cuddlers report the people who make you uncomfortable. Hopefully it can give you assurance and help reduce the folks who do not belong here. Always take care of you first. Good luck to you Tea. 🙏
Thank you @RustyCuddles 🫶
@TeaBabe I imagine you will give a lot of caution if you consider future cuddling and there’re so many supportive people here. I hope you have better experiences going forward. I have figured out the best way to remain completely safe! Best of luck to you. 🤗
@TheMidnightOwl to claim most men know a rapist is absurd and insulting. Also me and none of my or family were raised to think of women are only sex objects or useless trash.
@Kense
I understand how much cognitive dissonance you’re experiencing with this fact. Math is also hard. Statistically, if you know 10 men, on average at least one of them has used force or coercion in this way. The reality is men who have technically committed rape (though they typically are in denial about this) are not rare, and are not who people assume them to be based on stereotypes. So the men who’ve committed rape whom you know likely won’t be obvious. There’s a reason this crime is under the “dark figure of crime” and the least reported and prosecuted. So truly the rates of rapists walking freely amongst us are likely at least double or triple the known figures.
Also, the actual situation of a rape being committed is not what most people think it is, either. Hollywood almost always gets it wrong. Not surprising given the majority of directors and screenwriters are men who have no idea what this experience is like from a survivor’s perspective, and that field is so immersed in normalized rape culture they can’t see the forest for the trees.
Here’s another fact you won’t like -- the majority of men who commit rape are committing it against their wives.
If you’re insulted by all this, then be insulted that so many men feel entitled to women’s bodies and can’t hear no, not at me for highlighting this fact.
Where do these claims come from? I have a degree in criminal justice and criminology and have done extensive research on this topic. I also worked as a police officer in the U.S. military and as a victim advocate in the U.S. civilian justice system, specifically a county Superior Court. I am not merely speaking theoretically when I make these claims.
Again, if you don’t like these numbers take it up with the FBI who tracks violent crime in the U.S. and will also tell you the known figure on these crimes is a sliver of the actual numbers because it’s by far the least reported crime, mostly thanks to idiotic responses like yours from so many people which leave survivors feeling totally alone, shamed, and disbelieved.
I’m glad you were raised differently, but this doesn’t erase facts, nor erase that our world is immersed in rape culture, and to argue with me on this point to maintain your denial of this extremely common social issue, highlights that maybe you weren’t raised as exceptionally as you think you were.
@Kense insulting for sure.
@TheMidnightOwl All women know the Majority of our women friends have been raped?? Where are you getting your information? Unfortunately, there are a lot of predators out there. It’s just awful 😞, but, to say that the Majority of each woman’s friends have been raped?? Most men have a friend or friends that are rapists?? I’m sorry you feel this way, but, your statements are Not true.
If you think I’m reading that wall of BS you’re crazier than I already know you are .
@Kense @SweetCuddler33 - Pressuring somebody for sex until they finally say yes still falls under the category of SA if they didnt enthusiastically want it. It doesnt always have to be forced. Maybe you dont know anyone who is like that but you'd be surprised when you learn the dark side of some people you knew for a long time and had no idea who they really were.
@Mike403 Sorry , but, no.. I refuse to believe that any of my friends or people I know are predators .. of course, we are all entitled to our own opinions . I respect you as a person, I just have different opinion, views, beliefs .
@SweetCuddler33 You are misquoting me. Go back to re-read what I actually said. I recognize many people have shallow relationships where they don’t talk about anything meaningful, including their trauma histories. This likely includes you if you believe what you’re saying. If you surveyed your female friends anonymously, I guarantee the majority of them have stories where they’ve been at least sexually harassed which falls under the umbrella this thread covers and includes what I’m referring to in the point I made earlier you misquoted. I already stated where I’m getting these numbers. Feel free to look them up on the FBI website if you don’t believe me.
@Kense I know, it’s clear that reading comprehension isn’t one of your strong suits. I think we found the 1/10 he claims to not know, everybody. Note the giant 🚩🚩🚩 of dismissing me as crazy because I’m speaking truths he didn’t want to hear. This is a symptom of an abusive person.
I think you both missed an opportunity to hear that the OP is talking about an extremely common experience for women - including on this site. This wasn’t an invitation to argue with us or others about any of it.
@Mike403 Thank you. Glad to know someone else dwells in reality.
@TheMidnightOwl No need to be disrespectful and rude.to people who don’t agree with you. You are ruining this thread with your insults and abusive remarks. Now, I actually do know someone that is abusive.. it’s You with your insults . Written Verbal abuse. I’m not going to tolerate this abuse., I’m not going back and forth with you. Have a wonderful day 😊
Anyone can do a quick Google search and see for themselves what the facts state about rpe and SA (apparently the gov't classifies them differently). According to the NSVRC 1 in 5 women are rped on an annual basis, and that is just what is reported. Most of the women that I know personally have experienced some form of it, myself included on many occasions. Sometimes, I wonder if r*pe culture is so embedded in our society that some people don't recognize it for what it is. I know that to be true for DV until I took a class that taught me the true facts about DV. So many things I had dismissed as normal behavior were, in fact, forms of DV.