@Riverside77 - It'll most likely just kill the website and turn the place into s ghost town.
@Riverside77 This is an extremely bad idea. The vast majority of cuddles on the site are between pros and clients. Get rid of pros, and you'll kill the only reason for the site to exist for 95% of people. Note that years ago the site didn't have pros. There weren't any women enthusiasts here then either! Literally the only reason more than 5% of men here are able to find cuddles is because the site started allowing pros.
You might be able to get away with charging men to join the site. If you charge (non-pro) women, they will simply never join.
in addition it would weed out the females pros who are in it just for the money
No idea what this means. They're all in it for the money. If they weren't in it for the money they wouldn't charge.
@DarrenWalker OK, you're not a woman. But you also have some perspectives about sexuality and romance that are very different from the large majority of people. Which is perfectly fine. Good even. But I might suggest that maybe due to that, it's harder for you to relate to most heterosexual men.
What if I suggested to you, "I think you'd be happier if you'd just be a woman, embrace traditional femininity, and have romantic and sexual relationships with men." Now I don't know you well, but I suspect you would feel that's not you, it doesn't appeal to you, and even if you tried, you couldn't make that feel normal or good to you. You might also be annoyed or offended that I would suggest that.
It's similar for me. I can't change what I am and what appeals to me. Physical intimacy with men doesn't much appeal to me. Physical intimacy with women does. This is not a defect I need to fight to overcome. It's part of who I am. I couldn't change it even if I wanted to, and it's slightly offensive for people to suggest otherwise.
@CuddleMeLater: Of course all pros cuddle for money—that's what a pro is. But like @Riverside77 says, there are some pros who're in it just for the money.
As for the rest of it... hmm.
You seem to be saying that suggesting people cuddle folks they don't want to have sex with is comparable to telling an intersex person to "just be a woman." I gotta say—I don't see it.
Edit: It seems to me that telling a person they'd be happier if they conformed to gender roles that clash with their native personality is a bit different from suggesting that maybe men in general would be happier if they went back to snuggling one another like they used to. You know?
It's like chocolate and peanut butter. Even if most people only eat the two together, that doesn't mean the two are, somehow, inextricably linked. - @DarrenWalker
It's closer to water and tea (cucumbers and pickles, grape juice and wine) I disagree with the idea that there is no strong link. Also, I don't think most people regularly eat those together. In fact i can only think of reese's cups. I believe that the site is an excellent use case for those in similar positions to you. I don't think any changes should be made that would make it more difficult for you. I only believe that people with other beliefs and needs should be able to find them here too.
I would 100% leave the site if a fee were required and 95% would not have joined in the first place. There is no benefit to a membership fee. There should be clearer separation in the site so that enthusiasts aren't bombarded with messages asking to bribe for a response (turning those enthusiasts away) or vice versa.
Oh, in addition it would weed out the females pros who are in it just for the money, and more compassionate meaningful affection would be given. - @Riverside77
You can get a massage from a massage therapist and you get a massage from your s.o. Both massages will be meaningful and helpful. Just for different reasons.
I really hate that this thread has become "there aren't enough women on the site". I feel like I have made my suggestions and I am taking my leave of the conversation.
But like @Riverside77 says, there are some pros who're in it just for the money.
They're all in it just for the money. Or 99.9% of them are. I don't mean they never enjoy cuddling -- many of them definitely do. But money is the reason they're here, period.
It seems to me that telling a person they'd be happier if they conformed to gender roles that clash with their native personality is a bit different from suggesting that maybe men in general would be happier if they went back to snuggling one another like they used to.
I don't have a problem with physical affection between men, and I actually think it would be great if men were free-er to touch each other. That's fine. But it'll never take the place of affection with a woman. Never has, never will. And yeah, I do think suggesting otherwise is analogous to suggesting people conform to a gender role that clashes with their personality.
The issue with requiring personal information of any sort, especially IDs, is (1) security and (2) social stigma. Do I trust this site not to be hacked and for there to be blowback in my personal or professional life because cuddling is stigmatized? I would guess a large majority of members of the site would say they're not.
Possibly a paid membership platform could fail. But I will bring up this point. Just because you get paid, doesn’t mean you’re really a pro.
Just because you get paid, doesn’t mean you’re really a pro.
That's literally what the word professional means. If someone pays me to pick my nose, I am a professional nose picker, period, end of story.
https://www.dictionary.com/browse/professional?s=t
"following an occupation as a means of livelihood or for gain"
@lonelybutmaybe: You can't have tea without water, but you can have sex without cuddling.
@CuddleMeLater: The idea that getting money from an activity means you're only in it for the money strikes me as a fallacious one. Talk to a few pros: @MissAdventurous, maybe, or @ubergigglefritz. They're not in it just for the money. Maybe a pro can't afford to give the service they'd like to without charging—that doesn't mean they're just in it for the money.
Also, no cuddle buddy (of any sex) can really take the place of another. Cuddling with a woman can never replace cuddling with a man; cuddling with a man can never replace cuddling with a woman. Heck, cuddling with one man, or woman, or intersex person, can never take the place of cuddling with another. Not really. People aren't just warm bodies!
I'm definitely not suggesting that cuddling with one person could ever take the place of cuddling with another.
The idea that getting money from an activity means you're only in it for the money strikes me as a fallacious one. Talk to a few pros: @MissAdventurous, maybe, or @ubergigglefritz.
Do you think I've never spoken to pros before? I've spoken to both of them. And dozens of others! In fact I've laid around in bed with dozens of pros and talked to them for hours and hours. There was a time when I was seeing pro cuddlers 2-4 times a week. And it was (mostly) a great time. And I think almost all of the pros also really enjoyed being with me. And I also think the main reason they were there, by far overshadowing anything else they got out of it was... money.
@CuddleMeLater: Just money?
Yes. Just money. They were in it for the money. They may have other feelings about it, they may enjoy it, but every single one of them was there for the sole reason that I was paying them to be there. Why is that so hard to believe?
Oh, I see. Well. Thank you, @CuddleMeLater, for openly stating that you believe all pro cuddlers are in it for the money, and only for the money—that they don't cuddle for any other reason. I think it's nice that you're so honest.
@DarrenWalker if you try really, really, hard not too and keep your definitions super strict sure, I guess you might be able to argue that. Then again, you can always chew on some tea leaves and get the same nutrients you would get from tea.
I don't really agree with your position. Perhaps a better comparison is a glider and an airplane?
Pro cuddler:
Bachelor #1: soulful, honest and sincere. Even attractive. Smells nice, showers daily. Even twice. Has a sense of humor, respectable and understands limits and boundaries. Passionate about cuddling and ranks at the top 95 percentile as the best cuddlers in the world. Broke and lonely.
Bachelor #2: OK looking man who showers when he’s too dirty. Has a strange way with words but nothing alarming. Seems a little sad and clingy but that’s okay. Gives short answers to questions, and what’s that in the background of his picture....never mind. Willing to pay $150 an hour and wants 6 hours of time.
Pro cuddler picks #2.
I agree with so many ideas posted here. I’ll repeat some that have been mentioned, and more:
Official training for pros and feedback surveys to the site on their sessions. If they keep getting bad reviews for legitimate reasons then not allowing them to have a “pro” account would be next. And banning anyone without a pro account who tries to solicit money from others.
Reporting to and cooperation with law enforcement if anyone commits what would be considered a crime (ie sexual assault) - not just banning them.
A screening process for people when we sign up to include reading and agreeing to the site rules.
Charging for membership is counterproductive. If we want to communicate that this is a platonic site to meet people, then charging for the service gives people an excuse to expect more than platonic cuddles. And some of us are very poor and won’t join a site that costs money to engage with. I hear the men who’ve stated that without pros they probably would never get to meet anyone. There’s a need. Therapists charge for their services and some offer safe, platonic, healing touch during sessions - which due to covid aren’t happening until further notice in many offices. But they all have master’s degrees, abide by the rules of a licensing board, and often hundreds of hours of additional training for certifications. I can’t overstate how important mandating - and ideally offering - training is for pros. Covering ethics, boundaries, professionalism, techniques, etc. At a minimum.
Perhaps having some sort of survey to fill out that runs an algorithm on how likely you are to get along with other people based on their answers could also help save everyone time getting to know one another and could give ideas on topics to discuss. I know that’s not an original idea, but it’s good to utilize what’s worked elsewhere when trying to find solutions.
I’m sure I could think of lots more, but these are just off the top of my head or confirming what others have suggested in my comment skimming. Glad that attempts at improving are currently underway.
Edit: I just scrolled back up to read more comments and @xelda has captured it so well, once again! I agree with all her points, as well. Also strongly agree with @TouchSanctuary and @herby357
@lonelybutmaybe: Who the heck eats tea leaves plain. The same people who drink vinegar and chew on wine yeast, maybe? And I'm not sure what that would be in the metaphor. Hmm.
If water (cucumbers, grape juice) is cuddling, and tea (pickles, wine) is sex... then I guess tea leaves (vinegar, yeast) would be genital stimulation. So on its own that'd be masturbation. Maybe you get the same nutrients from chewing tea leaves that you get from drinking tea, but man the experience is sure different from consuming either water or tea.
Gliders and airplanes—I don't quite see it. Is the draw of this metaphor in the potential for customization?
"It's a glider, but it's got a motor on it—it's an airplane, but only for one person and you're very exposed. Ooh, where do we draw the line? Can a meaningful line even be drawn? Gliders and airplanes, so similar! Practically the same thing! Especially when you customize, which everyone does!"
@CuddleDuncan learning from this discussion, I want to go back on what I originally said regarding increased training for all pros. Perhaps the freedom that this site provides is also the solution considering the perspectives shared. Few points to consider:
@DarrenWalker
Who the heck eats tea leaves plain. The same people who drink vinegar and chew on wine yeast, maybe?
That is exactly my point.
Gliders and airplanes—I don't quite see it
A glider and an airplane both require pilots and understanding of lift. The controls of a glider and an airplane are similar. However the skill sets do diverge. A glider pilot may never need to learn about throttle, or engine mechanics, or fuel-to-air ratio. However, a glider pilot will need to learn about updrafts and landing in unconventional places. The glider is not capable (normally) of sustained or cross-country flight. A airplane pilot will need to know the basics of gliding, however, the engine the main provider of lift and typically updrafts will cause turbulence rather than extra lift.
A good glider pilot will excel at many aspects of flying airplanes, especially in situations were the engine fails. They still will have things to learn. A good airplane pilot will excel many aspects of flying gliders, especially when conditions are good. They still will have things to learn.
Neither pilot will ever be required to fly the other's vehicle. However, yes, an airplane is a glider with a motor on it. So they are wholly related.
I feel like you my be trying to take the metaphor too literally. The point is that this is a form of close physical affection and intimacy. Many of the goals and actions are similar. Again, I think that you have a very specific and hard-set worldview. I am not asking you to change it so much as understand that many people, some using this site differ from your views. Their view is valid too
@CuddleMeLater You said "I've spoken to both of them", but we don't have any message history? Are you referring to in the forums? While it may be true that many professionals will only be there "for the money", it's much bigger than your statement implies. Myself, I am full-time on the road in my motorhome, traveling from area to area, making circuits to the areas of all my clients. I am BARELY sustainable at this point (thank you COVID). Do you think I can afford to travel somewhere, pay for gas, pay for a campsite, and lose paid time in another location, for every individual I enjoy seeing? Absolutely not. Do you think it's fair to my paying clients for me to allow certain people to transition into non-paying friends I visit for free, but not do the same for everyone else? Absolutely not. So yes, I travel to a certain area, reserve a campsite, and schedule time to spend with someone "just" because I'm being paid, but even when I am not there, or clients who stop having sessions, I continue to think about them and care about them. So, I don't CARE just for the money, I just need the money to get there to see the people. I have clients I haven't seen in a year+ and I still think about them. One I'm worried about because last I heard he was really struggling with the COVID situation. People pay me so I can focus all of my working energy on it, expend virtually all of my social energy on my clients, and I don't have to stop in order to get another paying job. People do NOT pay me for my care and affection and compassion. That is my heart and has absolutely nothing to do with my getting paid. It is an unfortunate truth that money is required in this world to survive, so in order for me to spend as much time as I do, communicating with so many people (that's free by the way), traveling to the different areas, and providing the energy I provide to so many people, I NEED to be paid. Otherwise everyone would revert to occasional "text exchange" friends, and that's it. When I have a full-time job, I just don't have the time or energy to give what I am currently giving. I am thankful and feel blessed every day that I have been able to do this for as long as I have thus far. My heart and compassion are authentic. Money can be a confusing addition to the situation, but I try my best to navigate that balancing act. =(
@Riverside77
There is nothing alarming from your general description of Bachelor #2. As long as he passed my screening process (and willing to fill out my survey form and pay a deposit), of course I would have a session with him. But at the same time, willingness to pay does NOT guarantee a first session and certainly doesn't guarantee a second. There have been plenty of inquiries I have chose not to see, and plenty of paying clients I have chosen not to see again.
As for Bachelor #1, I have plenty of people I have kept in communication with who I have never had a session with and I'm not sure if I ever will. The unfortunate situation on this site is that those people tend to be people who contact me through other avenues since we're not allowed to take communication off of this site until we have a paid session. It doesn't happen as often with people I meet on here, because I'm just terrible at keeping up with this inbox. I prefer my business email and texting. =P
@Riverside77 I am a pro so I’d like to defend myself. This defence is more towards those that read your negative posts about pros, not to you, because you have your obvious opinions about pros that won’t change. You are perfectly in your right to not want to hire a pro but to slash down what I (and plenty others ) consider to be a great career and try to tarnish the idea of pro cuddling is harmful and filled with hatred. You don’t like the idea of it, super obvious. I would just really like it if you stop demeaning what I do and saying it’s not a job. This isn’t up to you to declare and shining this negative light on it for others to see is rude. We understand. You don’t like the idea of it. Leave it at that.
I accept money and make a career from cuddling, so yes, it’s a job and yes, I’m a pro. I accept money for a service. I have been doing this for almost 2 years. That is 100% what a pro is. And although I absolutely love cuddling, no, I would not do it for free. A masseuse will not go around willy nilly massaging people for free just because she loves doing it or because “bachelor #1” is a great guy. Of course I would choose #2. He doesn’t ring any alarms and is hiring me. Respect that it’s a career or find nicer things to say.
For those reading his negative comments, you absolutely don’t have to hire a pro. No one has a gun to your head saying you have to. Pros are not lessening the amount of enthusiast women. Others who have been here almost since this site was created have just said in this thread that the ratio of men to women has been like this long before pros were introduced. This is just the way it is in any platform where there are more men searching for something than women. Period. If you are having bad luck trying to talk to an enthusiast woman, try to have patience. You aren’t alone. I know it sucks. But don’t let it get you to be so bitter that you start to build a hatred towards pros or anyone else when there is no one to blame.
Pros have been here for a while now. We aren’t going away. Plenty of people have stated here that they enjoy having pros around. I’ve done nothing wrong. I would like respect as opposed to fingers pointing at me blaming me and other pros for their lack of success. Or if you just plain Jane hate the idea of pros just for the sake of it, hold that thought and instead of voicing your opinion rudely, express it in a healthy way. Go for a jog, take up painting, ice sculpturing, watch asmr kinetic sand videos.... anything....
My name is Sheena and I’m a pro cuddler... ( and I’m damn good at it...)
@lonelybutmaybe: Your point is that eating tea leaves (masturbating) isn't as pleasant as either drinking water (cuddling) or drinking tea (having sex)? It's... a strange point. I'm pretty sure we weren't arguing that.
True, the metaphor isn't perfect—tea always contains water, can't exist without it (tea leaves are no more tea than wine yeast is wine), while it's perfectly possible to have sex without cuddling—but the main point remains: tea isn't water. Water isn't tea. And while drinking tea technically entails the consumption of water, this in no way means that drinking water implies drinking tea!
You can cuddle without sex being even slightly involved, or even implied. Just keep the tea leaves out of it and you're golden.
I don't understand this argument that the two are inextricably linked—that you can't have one without the other. Even if cuddling were an intrinsic part of sex (which it's not), the two still aren't inextricably linked. You can have water without tea (or hot chocolate, or ramen, or coffee, or soup)—you can have cuddling without sex (or romance, or therapy, or a parent-child relationship).
The two are different things.
You can't logically argue that cuddling someone means you must want to have sex with them any more than you can logically argue that drinking water means you must want tea.
Edit: Yes, even though water and tea are both types of drink—even though cuddling and sex are both forms of physical intimacy.
@Sheena123 You absolutely nailed it.
@Envie: Yeah, she did.
@ubergigglefritz and @Sheena123, thanks for explaining so much better than I ever could! Yes, there are some pros on this site who're in it just for the money—but Gott im Himmel, to say it's all of them.
People like you, who put in the time and effort to make people's lives better, deserve at least the money you need to keep working.
Were I the hiring pros type, I'd hire you.
Yeah, cutting out pros isn't a sustainable option. Insisting on higher standards for pros? Well, that's tricky! It's not like there's a course one can take to learn how to be warm, empathetic, caring, and respectful (or I would've failed it years ago). What certificates are you gonna ask for? I'm not even sure how you could make certain a pro is trustworthy money-wise before giving them the pink P, never mind figuring out whether they're the type to ignore the client and put their own needs first.
Those types tend to weed themselves out, I think. Not ideal, but if you remove the pro option altogether you don't just lose money that could be used to run the site, you end up with a whole lot more unmarked pros to weed out the same way.
Especially if you're charging everyone to use the site. Who's not going to try to make that money back, if they can?
I do like the idea of a cuddle quiz before joining (or maybe before becoming active, whichever works best). Not only does that seem likely to cut down on the number of people who aren't clear about the meaning of the word "platonic," the questions could be used to give newbies a list of folks who share their interests or have characteristics they're looking for.
Or not. That second one could be tricky. But at least the first one.
Thank you everybody! I haven't even had time in the last couple of days to read this properly, never mind reply, but I am tremendously encouraged.
Keep the ideas flowing!
rentafriend.com has a membership fee and i found the people who contacted me on there were serious about booking vs "time wasters" who just wanna ask questions till the end of time but aren't serious about getting together. Theres is $25/month i think though. I think a small fee even if it's just $5/month would still be financially inclusive to many people, would deter flakiness, people are less likely to bail on something they've invested in. This fee might also deter incompetent professionals. I'd be willing to pay the fee if it improved the quality of the site or provided some enhanced safety feature. The part I wish these meeting-strangers sites would include is a background check or some sort of id upload. I'd be willing to volunteer my own info to the site as well. Just something to make the experience more safe and legit. I have people I check in with before and after sessions for safety, and i send them phone number, first name and photo of client if i have them. I don't mean to violate anyones privacy by sharing their info, and after session all that info is disgarded and irrelevent not misused in any way. But if the site isn't gonna protect us, I gotta be my own bouncer you know? So far my experience has been that over half of clients have tried to initiate something beyond platonic with me during session, but they all respected my boundaries when I shut it down. But yeah, I've already realized that having everyone click and agree to be platonic before messaging doesn't deter many people from frankly pretty daringly TRYING to make it sexual. I'm just grateful people so far have actually been responsive and stop when I protest??? Imagine if they didn't 😳
@DarrenWalker you've reversed my argument. "You must have water to make tea" is not the same was "you must have tea to make water". I never argued you have to like tea to need or enjoy water. In fact I chose tea partially because one of my brothers doesn't even like it. Still I think tea was the worst metaphor I made.
Here is my final argument for closure. I feel like the better argument is wine. 1. because there's two main types (white and red [rose also exists]) 2. because those types exist in grape juice too. I don't particularly like white wine and I don't particularly like white grape juice. I do like red wine and i do like red grape juice. The important thing to know about grape juice is that you have to pasteurize it for it not to ferment and thus contain alcohol. There must be a reason for the the grape juice to not become wine (because yeast is everywhere).
Wine's sweetness is determined by residual sugars, sugar that the yeast did not process. The more residual sugar the sweeter the wine. Less residual sugar means more alcohol. Both red and white wines have various degrees of residual sugar. However, no matter how much alcohol you want in your wine (grape juice) you can still prefer red wine. The preference isn't just because you are trying to get drunk.
I cannot convince you @DarrenWalker, any more than you can convince me. We have an entirely different set of worldviews. You don't need to view things the way I do, just acknowledge that my way of viewing is also valid. I want this site to work as well for me as it does for you.
I agree with an idea to create a division of pros and enthusiasts . An entire wedsite division . Get rid of the pros someone said . You can also say get rid of the enthusiasts and make this a pro only site .
If a women wants to be a professional cuddler there are two other websites they can apply to feature themselves on : snuggle buddies or cuddlist .
Yes I agree it’s not a fix for all problems . But if this were an enthusiast only site , it fixes some problems ... one of them being a message to a women enthusiast... “hey honey when can I book a session “ .
@Sheena123 said it perfectly! Spot on, girl.
Imagine being so selfish and out of touch with reality, you feel CC charging $60 a year for unlimited cuddles with as many women as you would like (with no pay for the women) is a more logical and fair concept than allowing women to choose their own prices for THEIR time and services.
So if you wanted to cuddle with 20 women in one year, CC should take your little $60 fee and split it amongst those 20 women??
Or are you expecting all of the women who are currently being paid for this service to now provide that same service to every man on this site for free??
AND let’s not forget, you‘re expecting this session to be full of compassionate and meaningful affection.
Please make it make sense.
There are far too many men who feel ENTITLED to a woman’s time and body and that is absolutely insane.
No one owes you a damn thing.
There’s a lot of blaming and shaming going on but not a whole lot of self-reflection...maybe you should try asking yourself: Is there anything I could’ve said or done differently? Could I have been more patient? Was I respectful of the other persons time and feelings? Did I come off as entitled or bossy? I’m sure if you truly thought about it, you’d find something you could’ve done differently.
A lot of men (not all) get on the forums and start to speak from a place of hurt, rejection, annoyance and/or anger. They have a negative experience and start to generalize pro cuddlers, as if we’re not individuals with our own unique personalities.
There are going to be good and bad people EVERYWHERE you go, no matter the website or app. A training course won’t prevent a pro from being disinterested or unprofessional during a session and a background check won’t prevent a client from overstepping boundaries or assaulting someone during a session. It’s up to you, as an adult , to exercise caution, use good judgement and be safe when communicating with and meeting anyone.
At the end of the day, pros are here to stay. It’s up to you to decide if you’re going to navigate through the site with a positive or negative mentality.