@MrPaul. I'm sorry for insulting you. and I respect that you seek the facts wherever they lead. It is true that speaking does produce airborne droplets that can carry pathogens, hence the masks. What is also true is that the risk of this particular pathogen is low. What I mean by that is that it has the normal risk of the flu. It is true, there are germs inside my body. There are germs on my skin. If I touch you, they can pass from me to you. Thats normal. If I breathe or cough on you, they can pass from me to you. That's normal for any germ. If we do normal things, we keep the risk low, we keep it normal. Hand washing, normal hygiene, covering your mouth when you cough, etc. There are germaphobes. Most famous one I know is Howie Mendel. That's fine, I respect that. But it is not normal for Howie to tell me to behave like him in my own home. I seek to normalize life, my own particularly, but if I can help others do the same by informing them of the facts, I will do that. You asked if I learned something was potentially dangerous, would I keep silent? I would inform them of the facts. Driving is dangerous, but it's a normal risk. Texting and driving is dangerous. Drinking and driving is dangerous. Texting and driving in a snow storm is dangerous. There studies that quantify these risk factors and their effects because the amount of aggregate information we have for it is so large. You didn't put out a new fact: speaking produces aerosols which can carry pathogens. You put out a new control: keep your voice down. The other things you have in your list (opening a window, controlling the humidity, being outside, changing your clothes) is further evidence that staying home as a covid mitigation factor is ineffective, aka lock downs don't work. There's information on the effects of various national policies throughout the world. I encourage people to inform themselves and make their own decisions. Let's be normal and get back to work.
If covid was real then how have I been going to the gym 3 times a weak without getting sick? 🤔
@ryechips if that is your litmus test then I dont think you can be rational enough to be told why it is real .
@ryechips Ah yes, it hasn't happened to you therefore it is not real.
@cookiecrumb The suggestions I presented were based on what I learned in the course so far, and I wanted to share the information because I considered it useful and not completely obvious. I think it is helpful to know these details. I did not know that both very low and very high humidity prolonged the viability of the virus in air until I took the course, as that is not obvious. I also did not understand the relative effectiveness of room air filters vs. outside air ventilation vs. masks until it was quantified in a clear way. I figured why not share what I learned? I left out all the math and supporting information because it is not necessary to understand all the underlying details to get the benefit of these recommendations.
I don’t see how you draw the conclusion that the suggestions I presented are evidence that staying home as a mitigation method is ineffective. The subject here is viral transmission mitigation and what to do to reduce the concentration of potentially harmful viral particles. The information I gave assumes at least one person you share space with is infected, perhaps I need to clarify that important assumption.
By the way, the course is very interesting and also free. It helps to have knowledge of calculus and differential equations and I find it enjoyable - but I also like math and physics. Here is a link to it. https://www.edx.org/course/physics-of-covid-19-transmission-course-v1mitx10s95x3t2020
@ryechips Getting COVID is like a lottery. You have to buy a ticket if you’re going to win. Just because you’ve been “buying tickets” three times a week at the gym doesn’t mean you’re going to win a prize.
@ryechips - I never had cancer. Therefore cancer isn't real.
The argument against lock downs is usually put forth by people who have little medical experience, ignore the mounting death toll, ignore the lack of ICU beds in many areas, and don’t care that it is so bad in some states like California that the healthcare system there is about to collapse. They only care about getting back to making money, which is important, but I don’t want to be told by these people advocating that lock downs don’t work what to do.
@cookiecrumb spoken like someone who hasn't felt the impact or had exposure to the reality of how bad this can actually be . It is easy to say these things when it hasn't impacted you. Like I said , I see it in the hospital all the time . We have a full ICU with people on vents and then two covid units on other floors for people who are more stable. I've seen people die and have severe problematic outcomes with no major health issues is the past . The private insurance companies that usually have a rigorous pre authorization process for approving discharges to short term rehab facilities are foregoing their processes in order to speed up discharging patients because our hospitals are at capacity. I had to provide grief support to a daughter who lost her 45 yr old father this weekend. He was stable then his oxygen dropped , was coded , intubated, and died the next day . These are the things I see and is the reason why I get annoyed when I hear covid precautions as an affront to personal liberty. It is a very privileged statement to be able to make.
@pmvines - I quit talking to my sister and her husband due to how seriously they are taking the pandemic. They are still laughing at it like it's the biggest joke they've ever heard.
@Mike403 I hope they stay well and are able to avoid it
I personally won't, because I don't feel safe to. I live with other people who wouldn't want me to do it, and I have to respect that.
Having a cuddle is not worth risking my health or theirs, but if other people want to meet up and cuddle then that's up to them. I can't say I respect that choice but I respect their autonomy to make it.
Wow.
There's so much to take in from just this discussion alone.
@cookiecrumb Thank you. I really appreciate how real you are about actually living one's life.
@MrPaul Also thank you. I appreciate you sharing this information.
In general for me, it's important to be able to make my own decisions and not have people try to force things on me. This discussion made me (personally) believe that @MrPaul just wants to share information.
I'm glad, because I've been too hard on the defensive since March, thinking too hard about control (which was a big cause for me feeling depressed). Some people I know are way too much about control for me though, and are people I don't talk to much anymore haha. But maybe more people than it'd seem are just sharing info, whichever way you'd like to use/not use it is fine.
The way I'm personally handling my own precautions are somewhere in the middle.
Throughout the pandemic, I've felt I've already lived a very isolated life through my childhood. I really don't need any more isolation.
The only public place I go indoors in is for foodshopping around 3-4x a month. I wear a mask, though I await the day I can feel my face and see others again. Every 5 weeks I go to get waxed, also with masks on.
The balance for me has been hanging out with a few close friends every so often, making sure what we're both comfortable with, and moving on with things. Without a job to commute to, I go to forests and parks. There are other details, but hey! I'm not gonna say what you should or shouldn't do either! Haha
I believe the pandemic will be ending soon enough. Now that the virus escaped from its origin and made its way into just about every country (I'm guessing?), it seems it'll only be stopped by herd immunity. Herd immunity will be helped by more people being exposed over time, and vaccines. Its cute little 2020 spotlight is ending. We have lives to live.
@2kCarlos. I find it helps to set boundaries with people who are overstepping on the control thing. Some family kept lecturing me repeatedly assuming it was necessary even though I've lived a way too isolated life for many years. I think they are scared and believe it's necessary to repeatedly interrogate and warn people even if that person is living more safely than them. The boundaries have helped.
I also put a site blocker on my computer so it wouldn't allow me to click on articles about covid and deactivated facebook. It lessened some of the intensity of my anxiety and depression. The relentless pessimism and divisiveness throughout this pandemic likely made both the pandemic and the mental health toll far worse than it needed to be. Why wouldn't someone get pandemic fatigue or struggle with their mental health if they have no hope things will get better?
I do think the 2020 spotlight will be ending. I've heard 40% of all fatalities were people in care homes which is why care home residents and staff are getting vaccinated soon.
I try to be careful for the sake of those who are vulnerable. However, all this has made me realize I need to make some changes in my life. I'm seeing how I had a problem with being controlled by others well before covid. I'll change what I can safely change now. Eventually, I will be changing even more.