Saying NO

[Deleted User]Unknown (deleted user)
in Pro Cuddling
Ok my people, NO is a complete sentence. If your client does anything against the Client Service Agreement, you have the right to:

Say No. And here are some other ways to say it:
*Under the shirt/shorts is not allowed.
*That's too high (example: hand over clothes but on ribcage near breast--this happened to me, that's what I said, and it worked like magic.
*I don't feel comfortable with _____.

You can also guide the client's hand away from the NO zone/s or simply LEAVE. The CSA spells this out.

Same rights apply to clients, of course; anything that violates the CSA gives either party the right to object. Incidental/accidental touching is another case and must be gauged by the individual.
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Comments

  • MorpheusMorpheus
    I find threads like this fascinating. In over 100 sessions with 19 pros, I have never once had a pro say no, don't do that or stop. I've heard them on several occasions say, please do that some more lol Seriously though, what are these guys doing out there to you pros?
  • [Deleted User]Unknown (deleted user)
    @MrSoloDolo If a pro cuddler wants to make an exception, that is their deal. My post was inspired by a cuddler I heard about who had their client violate the CSA several times by going under their shorts. Apparently she felt she could not say No or walk away.

    In any case, tbe CSA is a protection, and neither party needs to violate it in order to have a nice snuggle.
  • [Deleted User]Unknown (deleted user)
    MORE to the pro cuddlers: What I do is read the CSA before each session, and that way it stays fresh in my mind.
  • greenearth2greenearth2
    You could print it out and laminate it and just hang it on the wall where you cuddle with clients.   Like how they have ohsa posters at work.  
  • MorpheusMorpheus
    @starlight what do you mean about a Pro making an exception? Also do you feel that this post that you made represents the majority of clients or a minority of clients? 
  • MorpheusMorpheus
    edited May 2017
    What I'm trying to say is that when I read threads  this, it makes it sound like all clients are out there groping and humping and it just paints a bad name for clients. It just really comes off as an overgeneralization which has to be incorrect. If it was correct and all clients were like that, no one would want to be a pro Cudler. 

  • [Deleted User]Unknown (deleted user)
    @Starlight absolutely spot on. NO is a complete sentence. 

    Only ONE cuddle client has never pushed a client agreement boundary and that is the one I speak so highly of. 

    Just one. 

     Just because people are sharing their own personal experiences here is no need for the people reading to get defensive or post their "stats"  unless someone is directing a comment straight at you.  It's very important for these experiences to be shared so there is an understanding that it really does happen frequently, without the experience being down played or dismissed.  

     I am friends with seven different professional female Cuddlers and many of them state they have similar experiences with boundaries being pushed two or three or even five times in a session. A person should only have to say NO once. And it happens a lot to women in general in our daily lives, too. This isn't really anything new for a woman. 

    Now, I also get groped and fondled (in a second base kind of way) every single time I fly. Does every person who goes through security post 9/11 always get groped by TSA? I don't know. But literally tell every last one of them that they should buy me dinner first before touching me that way. 2 dozen times at least. My family members bet money that I'm going to knock someone out for how much under boob and between the thighs the TSA person does. It could be a curvy blue eyed 1% of the worlds population redhead thing, I hear we are magic like a unicorn. Or it could be that the men who are more serious about cuddling and spend a lot of free time on this site are not the average client.  @Mark  has said that several times.  I have asked some people if they read the forums and they didn't even know they existed or visit very infrequently. 

    I don't think it's too off-base to realize someone who doesn't spend tons of time reading through these threads or isn't completely submerged in a platonic cuddle culture, or hearing the discussions and personal stories on a regular basis might think cuddling is a gateway to hooking up or getting a little extra something on the side.  But in my personal experience and with the women Cuddlers I've talked to, it is much more common than not. 


  • greenearth2greenearth2
    The reason she didn't stop it was she was afraid of making him mad because he knew where she lives and she was alone with him.  It wasn't because she didn't know that NO was a complete sentence or that she didn't know ways to say no.  It was fear...not lack of language skills.  

    Anyway as for labeling all clients as predators...if you spend a lot of time only talking about the negative clients, it does give the impression that all clients are bad.  there's a possibility that a lot of clients are in fact bad..maybe they are?  But I wonder if they are even reading any of this...they probably aren't posting anything.  Bad people like that, usually like to stay under the radar and not making themselves noticed.  










  • [Deleted User]Unknown (deleted user)
    edited May 2017
    I will not dignify snarky/sarcastic remarks aimed at getting a sound bite.

    I will address my comment about exceptions. I had a client that went a bit under the shirt at my neckline and I was not ok with that, and said so. For others, this would barely be out of bounds in their minds. It was possibly even incidental, but that does not matter. The point is to say No.

    In my case, I remind each client to read and agree to the CSA within 24 hrs of a session, so there is no question I will object. By the way, the client was fine with my correction of that action.

    @greenearth Did I label all clients as predators? I don't see how I did. My post was *inspired* by what you told me, it was not a 1:1 example. Though I will say that it's possible if she objected the very first time, tbe client *may* have stopped. We shall never know. In her case, she would probably best not host anymore.
    Also, the sudience for this is the pro cuddlers, NOT the baddies.

    Thank you, @FireAndBlue, for your support and a fellow woman's (and pro's) point of view!!!! LOL about the TSA and your magic unicorn comment! And the fact that it's a common occurrence for clients to either "slip up" in the case if incidental touching (I'd like to give some benefit of the doubt here) or deliberately push the boundaries.

    @MrSoloDolo When I reread my post, I don't see that it is painting all clients as gropers. Take a step back and re-read. Maybe pretend you're a woman who's a pro cuddler (to whom these types of things can happen most often). And be objective; I was. It's based on actual things that can happen. You might as well call out @mark on the CSA itself if you think that my post painted clients as perverts. It's for our protection. And so is learning how to say No--for pros AND clients alike. Like I said in my post.
  • MorpheusMorpheus
    @starlight we as good clients are absolutely sick and tired of these types of threads. If prosnhave an issue with a client, follow the proper steps and go report them. How would pros like it if the boards were full of comments calling pros thieves and prostitutes. The majority of pros are amazing but there are a handful that fit the description of thrives and prostitutes just like the majority of clients are most likely great. Smh 
  • MorpheusMorpheus
    @fireandblue how many times are you going to say that you're done with the boards yet continue to return lol
  • [Deleted User]Unknown (deleted user)
    I gave my one very respectful client who is a perfect gentleman plenty of praise. He deserves it.  I'm not focusing on the negative, I'm being straightforward about my experiences.  Numbers wise, there has been a lot more groaping and boundary pushing than there has been genuine interest in platonic therapeutic cuddling. But I've never been a quitter, and hopefully through the monthly gatherings I'm organizing/holding locally we can form an even stronger cuddle community. 

    Maybe these clients who are not following the rules should be the ones taking notice that we won't be quiet about bad behavior and giving us a lot less to talk about by actually behaving properly. It's not going to stop women from speaking up about following the rules and not doing things like grabbing body parts covered by undergarments and humping…

    Instead of telling women we shouldn't speak up about it because it's actually happening, maybe being proactive as men interested in cuddling and make changes instead of going the "but *i'm* not like that" route. These stories need to be shared and validated  instead of dismissing and brushing them off. 

     I will continue to be honest about my experiences, positive or negative, I'm not focusing on one or the other. I'm stating the facts. Let's get more positive experiences going so the numbers shift to much fewer negative experiences. I'm sure when  professionals start having a lot less negative to talk about they will be happy to share that!

    Ive never had any issues with being firm, speaking up for myself or using the word no. But I understand that's not the case for everyone. Men or women. Throughout history people with bigger voices have stood up for and spoken out for people who didn't have as big of a voice. I don't have a problem being that person. 

    #BlueEyedRedheadMagicalUnicorn  
    (That is for you my friend @Starlight) we can goof off on Facebook again later after I get my  son to the doctor. ❤️

    I hope everyone has a good day and stay safe. 
  • [Deleted User]Unknown (deleted user)
    edited May 2017
     How many times are you and green earth going to continue to tag me when I have a very specifically asked at least 100 times now that neither of you do that? 

     What I have stated is that I do not intend to get into conversations specifically directed at either of you two, you continuously instigate and bait. I'm not interested in having a direct conversation with people who are nasty toward me. I am interested in being part of a community of positive good people.  I'm also not going to leave a community that I am very invested in because two people are trying to force certain people out. That isn't going to happen. 

     Both of you stop addressing me directly, for the hundredth time.  I am answering a thread that several people have participated in.  It is a group discussion. You don't see me tagging either of you with the blue link. Everyone knows that sets up a notification through email that you have been tagged in a post. 

    Ive told you way too many times to stop it. Ignoring those requests over and over will get you banned. Stop tagging me and just leave me alone. But you won't silence me. 

    Carry on.  


  • greenearth2greenearth2
    I haven't tagged anyone here. What do you mean ? 
    You keep replying to my posts so I have every right to reply to yours.  Demanding someone stop replying to your comments and then replying to their comments is basically the definition of hypocrisy.  

  • [Deleted User]Unknown (deleted user)
    Grow up. Stop addressing me and I won't have anything to reply to. The end. 
  • greenearth2greenearth2
    By the way we are free to post here on the forums just like you are. You have no right to demand we don't reply to posts here. 
    As for tagging you.  I don't tag you.   Check my posts here and you won't find any.   Others can see that for themselves.   so I don't know why you claim that over and over. 
    Also I haven't directly addressed you either in days.   So there's no need for the rude posts about sending me links to reading comprehension sites.  


  • [Deleted User]Unknown (deleted user)
    Amen, @FireAndBlue! Let the clients who are saying they're amazing back it up by keeping to the CSA. For those who do, thank you!
  • [Deleted User]Dekooning (deleted user)
    Boy o boy.....just had a newer member, not local for me, communicate she was erasing her profile...cc wasn't for her after following some some of the forums.... this was despite my attempts to answer (?s)... ... and even contextualing interactions... Just something for all of us to think about...
  • [Deleted User]Unknown (deleted user)
    @Dekooning That is her choice. What are you getting at?
  • greenearth2greenearth2
    Surprised a newbie even noticed the forums.   I often see pros who never read them even after being here for months.  

  • [Deleted User]Unknown (deleted user)
    I've read the forums from Day 1. But that's up to the individual--how much they already know, and how much they want to learn.
  • greenearth2greenearth2
    Not sure what they learn from these forums.  The pros I see aren't even posting here very much.  So their experiences aren't being shared with anyone.  

  • [Deleted User]CuddleBunny88 (deleted user)
    I've been cuddling for several years and a member of CC for over a year now. Honestly I've experienced a lot of inappropriate behavior coming from *some* clients as well. There were a few times I had to take a couple months break from CC and I only saw regular clients. I couldn't fathom the idea of logging on and fishing through new client messages, only to be asked how far I'll go or what benefits I offer. I'm sure this alone will turn many people away from the site. If your skin is thick enough, you can last and continue on. 

    Really though, you should only have to say "no"
    "please stop"
    "that makes me feel uncomfortable"
    ONCE

    It should not be an issue at all. This is why it's really important to enforce the CSA and make sure everyone you book with is aware of the rules and your expectations. People (pros and clients) should report and block ANYONE who crosses the boundaries. I shouldn't have to worry about a client expecting more, just because some pros are offering extras on the side. I shouldn't have to feel like my safety might be as risk every time I go into a new session. If we report and block inappropriate profiles of both pros and clients, we could help make CC a safer place.

    Lately I can gladly say I've been seeing less of this. I have been way more cautious of who I book, I check their profile to make sure I'd like to meet them and they don't seem creepy.

    Ways to stay safe: Talk to your clients, screen them and their profiles, ask what they're looking for out of the session, set boundaries, be comfortable saying NO, look for red flags, don't book if you feel uncomfortable at ALL, report and block all profiles that ask for more or seem off, and lastly stay safe and use common sense. We ultimately all want the same thing. A positive and therapeutic experience, let's not ruin it❤️

     
  • [Deleted User]Unknown (deleted user)
    Right on, @CuddleBunny88!
  • funandadventurefunandadventure
    @CuddleBunny. Dear Cuddle, you have my 100% support, I see so many profiles and whirl they are not wrong by CC rules they are not right either, no words, no thoughts. THIS IS NOT A DATING WEB SITE.
    Play safe all of you Companions, If was not for you this site would not exist.
    Love and peace, John Auckland NZ
  • [Deleted User]Dekooning (deleted user)
    Starlight She thought there was often too adversarial interaction going on in the forums... to many men especially.... yes it was her choice. unfortunately she said she was buried in messages including suggestive ones which caused her to center on the problems and issue discussed in the forums.....not enough of the positive experiences people had with cuddling...  
  • greenearth2greenearth2
    People sign up and then delete their accounts every week.  Been seeing it for the past year on this site.  They sign up and probably get a ton of weird messages and then leave.  
    That was happening before any of us used the forums too.  

  • pmvinespmvines
    I'm actually surprised that somebody talking about a negative experience they had and some people should be reminded of the rules as a result is even a source of contention. How is this something to debate? The appropriate thing is to say that it sucks that happened, its not your fault, you did nothing wrong, and hopefully it wont happen again. No arguing or questioning or trying to minimize. Very petty thing to do.
  • MorpheusMorpheus
    Some people just like to take things over the top and focus on the negativity, I would love to see everyone talk about the positive experiences that they've had. 
  • pmvinespmvines
    Be that as it may, if someone wishes to post about something negative that has happened they have that right. No harm comes from it, but trying to take the importance of what it means to that person does nothing but take away from what they experienced and the meaning and purpose gets lost. If it is positive experiences you wish to discuss, perhaps start a thread about it. I don't agree with or find interest in all the threads here, but I really do try hard to not criticize the topic or the person, and try to only post if I have something to add.
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