@Sheena123 well thank you for the apology. Most wouldn't apologize but you did. So there's that... which I'm grateful for. No, trust me, I'm not "confused". It's the spirit of this thread and all the nonsense I read.
Don't lose sight of what the purpose was of this thread. Your profile for example. You apparently can ask for $400 and fly around to Florida and Canada and never take your clothes off. And you have a long list of don'ts and conditions to navigate through. Pro Men on here couldn't even get $40 and would probably be the nicest most accommodating cuddler for someone just out of the kindness of their hearts. BUT... we aren't worth anything and of little value to be given an actual valued exchange. Only to be parasitically taken advantage of from either direction, giving or taking. That's the point of this discussion. Am I wrong? Anyone? AND...if you wish to declare I'm wrong, can you back it up with legitimate explanations?
Yes .... I need a hug (if that's what you're saying to yourself as you read that). Yes, I need a hug .... but it'll cost me!!!
@Governor I empathize with the anger you feel, I too have a profile which was reported as an untagged pro and I felt a bit annoyed. I agree that you need a hug, but it's unlikely the tone of your post is going to get you very far here. The passive aggressive behavior isn't going to get you anything - if you want to accept an apology, accept it and leave it at that. If you don't want to, then don't. But don't say you accept it and then go off on an angry rant about what someone can charge and someone can't.
@Governor , do I detect some jealousy?
Many women on this site - not just pros - have quite the list of dos and don’ts because we’ve HAD to develop a list. Read them. Ask yourself exactly why we would have to list all those things if it weren’t for the problems we’ve encountered with men who have led to us having to create a list of what is acceptable and what is not.
It doesn’t matter if one is the best cuddler in the world. If there’s no market for what one has to offer, then that’s a situation to be contended with. It is not the fault of any female pros that there is very little demand for male cuddlers.
The fact of the matter is that only a small minority of women with pro accounts are doing more than a handful of appointments, if any. The very few pros who stay busy put effort into promoting themselves, getting training, and maintaining a high degree of professionalism. Successful female pros are successful because of the effort they put into it.
Unfortunately, even with effort we’ve seen very few male pros be able to make a go at it and that is sad. Why is that? I would put forth there’s probably a number of reasons but what comes to mind is that very few women feel comfortable making themselves that vulnerable to a male stranger and women, in general, have less disposable income.
In a service industry like this clients pick who they want to cuddle with. There is no affirmative action. It’s the world we live in. Don’t take it out on the pro women, they are not your problem. If you think of yourself as worthless because you want to market something for which there is little to no demand, then I would humbly suggest you think about how you derive your sense of self-worth.
All I told her was to cool her jets. Her comment was not in alignment with what the thread was truly about. She could have sent that message to me privately and inquired that way ... to be helpful as it was intended to be.
No....the real problem here is this site is a joke in a lot of ways. You stated "folks" so I assume you mean male and female. No ... it's the parasitic nature here. You Babichev seem to be the only one I've communicated with (in the StL and mid Missouri area) who actually wants to cuddle just for cuddle sake. Everyone else has always wanted something more. Whether Pro or not,, you get their hard luck stories, their needs, etc and men are expected to hand it over.
But if "we" ask for some type of "Pro" consideration, we are dismissed.
In many ways this site is a joke I've found over the last 2 years.
@Governor - then why are you here?
Excellent question. I've asked myself that this last year. You've been the only one I've spoken with who actually is a legitimate cuddler and not wanting "something" besides the legitimate reason this site exists.
@Babichev _"then why are you here? " Oh my gosh! _😊 I have always wanted to ask that in the forums!!! So super wonderful of you! 👍
@CuddlesByDeep - I feel I can accept an apology and still make a point. And I don't agree with your passive aggressive comment. My tone is justified and should be heard in light of what this thread is about.
Besides, I'm not looking for a free hug. I know it would cost me one way or another. There is so much hypocrisy and double standards here. All I'm doing is pointing them out.
So ... I can accept apologies and still be hear with continued discussion and my insight? Or should I just be passified and stay quietly in my seat?
@OhioMike - That made me laugh.
Really, it’s not meant to scold anyone, it’s a legit question and one I ask myself sometimes in some situations.
@Governor - I’m still here if you’re ever in St. Louis. My place is less than ideal but you’re welcome here and you’d get to meet the amazing Bambina the bunny.
As for women wanting something from you, giving hard luck stories, whatever - we each have our crosses to bear. For us women it’s guys pushing boundaries. I had to take a break from this site at a point because every single time no matter how carefully and explicitly I explained my boundaries and expectations, every guy pushed them anyway. I was ready to throw in the towel. After a break I came back. Fortunately I’ve had a couple of good experiences since then. Out of probably eight or nine encounters I’ve met I think three good cuddlers and two live out of town. I met one in town recently but 45 minutes away and we have incompatible schedules.
@OhioMike - i agreed with her. That's why no one has really heard from ne for a year. In the chance you missed it,, I agreed with her..
and @Babichev - I'm glad for you, those positive experiences. Good for you!!! And thank you for your offer. As previously stated by me, you're one of the good ones here.
@Governor says: No ... it's the parasitic nature here. You Babichev seem to be the only one I've communicated with (in the StL and mid Missouri area) who actually wants to cuddle just for cuddle sake.
I hate to break it to you - but if with some magic all pros tomorrow suddenly became "free" - you'd unlikely get many cuddles either. That's because every female pro will be bombarded with requests - way more than they would have time for, and statistically speaking, you won't be in the top list of requests which will actually get fulfilled.
There is nothing parasitic here, It's basic economics of supply and demand.
And from the very beginnings of society, men have been exploited for the resources they bring and women have been exploited for the nurture they provide. It isn't any different now in our modern society. I didn't make the system, but that is the system.
@CuddlesByDeep - good grief buddy. Stick to the topic. I understand supply and demand. You're not "breaking" any news to me. Stay with me ... stay with this topic thread of "women paying for a male Pro and the devaluing of men as caregivers". It's like I'm trying to explain why the clock is broken and you're just telling me what time it is.
@Governor, sending you a hug if you would like it. Besides that, I've really said all I am going to say on this topic.
Do pros have to pay a $20 monthly flat fee?
Stay with me ... stay with this topic thread of "women paying for a male Pro and the devaluing of men as caregivers"
Well, maybe I'll say this one last thing - women don't look to men as "caregivers." They look to men as providers and protectors. Yeah, it's the reality brought about by evolutionary biology.
@snugbuddy - I believe that male pros pay a flat $20/month fee, female pros pay 15% of what they charge for a session. Someone else can correct me if I’m wrong.
I think the reason it’s set up that way is that, as @CuddlesByDeep said, since men with pro accounts mostly don’t have clients, it’s to discourage random men from setting up pro accounts for the heck of it. (And trust me, there are quite a few of those anyway.) With women, since enough of them have enough paid sessions booked through the site, it works out better for the site that way. Again, I could be wrong on this, if someone knows better then please correct me.
I think other sites charge pros more like 30%.
@Babichev - Jealousy generally refers to the thoughts or feelings of insecurity, fear, and concern over a relative lack of possessions or safety.
So no, that detection you think you sense is inaccurate.
Pointing out double standards, manipulation of facts, and misguided assumptions is not jealousy. Jealousy has nothing to do with this discussion thread.
Sorry.
@CuddlesByDeep thank you for the hug!
@Babichev you’re correct on the pay towards the site. I’d love to pay just $20 a month lol I would save hundreds 😅😅 some other cuddle site I was on charged 40% 😓😓
. .
@Governor - I’m missing something. What double standards, unless you’re referring to the different pay structure for male and female pro cuddlers. Also male cuddlers are not required to cuddle other men. What manipulated facts? What misguided assumptions?
I'm a male cuddler. Best part about me is that, I PAY YOU when you have a session. Women hit me up if interested
@Babichev says: I believe that male pros pay a flat $20/month fee, female pros pay 15% of what they charge for a session. Someone else can correct me if I’m wrong.
Yes, indeed I think this is what the pricing structure is.
I'm not going to start another pro price thread, but since the topic of this thread is being a male pro, I'm going to say that this price structure is discriminatory. It's certainly a sexist policy, applying the strict definition of that word.
If the site insists on a commission model, I think a far fairer model would be one where all pros pay a base monthly fee + a smaller percentage (less than 15) of their earnings.
As it stands now, there are tons of female pro profiles which aren't active. One would waste their time contacting them, they just don't check their messages or respond. Where is the "professional" experience there? Having a base monthly fee will certainly weed out the opportunists who set up a pro account for the heck of it.
@EVERYBODY.........Thank you for all your input and responses to my discussion. Some of it got intense, but I love the raw honesty. I didn't expext this much of a response but it is truly appreciated!
I think it could be a bit of a catch 22, since females and some males might rightfully be apprehensive about using free male cuddlers generally, but at the same time I think because pro male cuddling is still so somewhat new and so small, any male cuddler would probably make a loss for some time, or even a long time, just paying the pro membership fees before breaking even or making a profit. So a bit of a vicious circle and catch 22 maybe? I would like to try this and have for some time, though that part is slightly off putting but I understand that it is an investment. A commission type alternative would be great in the sense of being able to pay fees but actually make profit too.
@Governor “Stay with me ... stay with this topic thread of "women paying for a male Pro and the devaluing of men as caregivers".
Has it occurred to you that women aren’t the ones devaluing men as caregivers? Has it occurred to you men are doing this to themselves?
If men saw other men as caregivers, they would seek the have their (massive collective need) for nurture and affection met by MEN as well as women. But men don’t seek to have their nurture and affection needs met by other men even though they know themselves very capable of offering these qualities (as you, yourself have boasted about your own giftedness in this area earlier in this thread).
On the contrary not all women are gifted in being nurturing and affectionate. If they were many men with committed partners would not be on this site, their needs would be met within their partnership. The “lie” that all women are naturally good at nurture hurts everyone. I’m sure the line for a thread about “cold and affection-less” mothers would be a mile long. (Unfun fact: I studying parenting and child development, did you know women are no less likely than men to be physically abusive towards children?)
Being gifted in touch, affection and closeness is a HUMAN quality, apart of gender. The problem is as a society it is SO deeply ingrained that affection and love should be sought from women, that men get angry, aggressive and frustrated when they aren’t getting these things from women. Many men (like yourself) seem to want to rely on women alone to meet this need.
I’m going to share a hot take nobody is going like.
The collective loneliness in men in America is not going to be solved by women. Even if all the women in the US (who are gifted in nurture and affection) turned around tomorrow and started giving it away for free, it wouldn’t be enough. Ya’ll are lonely, touch starved and in desperate need of connection. Frankly they aren’t enough women to meet this need. It’s like trying to fill the Grand Canyon with a garden hose.
Men will have to begin to value each other as caregivers if the scales of loneliness and connection are ever going to come into balance.
Empathy doesn't have a gender. I've thought about being a pro cuddler, and I'm mainly concerned about how toxic the energy transfer might be for me. Cuddling another man wouldn't be such an issue, but cuddling anybody who caused me to feel toxic would be a problem.
I would think that a pro profile that isn't active would be someone who has not logged on for a while. You can screen for those in your search. (I always look for people who have logged on in the last 30 days.) Even the ones who are active (at least the females, from what I have heard) are absolutely buried in requests. While this is NOT a dating site by any means, the breakdown is similar -- way more men than women, and the women who are out there get deluged with so many asks that they may not even see yours.
I want to guarantee someone will play with my hair. I've only met women (and gay men) who are good at this. If I'm> paying for a session I want to make sure it's going to include my favorite thing.
That's funny. I love playing with women's hair... and I'm not gay. You just gotten tell me how.
@Jkay
Frankly they aren’t enough women to meet this need.
There are just as many women as there are men...
Even if all the women in the US (who are gifted in nurture and affection) turned around tomorrow and started giving it away for free
Remember when affection was by default something that one gave for free, and the idea that it could be bought and sold would have been considered unusual or even outrageous? I do. Now apparently it's the opposite. "Giving it away for free" is the unusual case.
The problem is as a society it is SO deeply ingrained that affection and love should be sought from women
In your view is it also only societal indoctrination that leads (most) men to think they only want sex from women?