I have really enjoyed how the conversation has branched off into other areas. It does seem that there is still an unwritten or automatically accepted double standard. If cuddling is truly beneficial for both, why is the pay necessary? Or is it assumed to be more beneficial to the party paying? This website runs on professional payments, so I get that it is necessary as a business model. The 2 paradigms of practice are #1 “professional offering beneficial cuddling services to a client for a fee” or #2 “Two clients both benefitting from cuddling services with no fee”. I’m intrigued by the psychology and sociology of both. Someone mentioned that I was seeking companionship instead, but that’s just not true. I’m seeking paradigm #2, someone who believes the cuddling is beneficial enough to not require a fee for both parties. I believe this is different than therapy in that a therapist treats a patient, the therapist is not meant to benefit outside of compensation. Cuddling under paradigm 2 is meant to benefit both equally. I could easily also argue that paradigm 1 is necessary for this to even exist. Just idle thoughts!
I believe that hospice is beneficial. As somebody who is employed in hospice care I love my work, and although I would happily provide care for a loved one for free, I do require to be paid to do my job when it comes to my employer and providing care for strangers. I don't know why there is always this circular argument that because you enjoy something or because it helps benefit you in some form or another means that you are exempt from having it as an income source and are somehow being selfish.
But you are always free and welcome to put in the work needed to find a cuddle friend who is not a cuddle pro
@jmcalpine You can find cuddle buddies for free but you have to put in the work. You have to take time getting to know them as an individual and it takes time and effort.
In my experience here, most men are not willing or able to do that. If you want cuddling in a more efficient manner then you can hire a paid pro.
I've been off and back on this site for many years, have only paid for one cuddle session and had only one cuddle session. I admire the pros who make it very clear that they offer professional cuddling. In many ways, you become a therapist more than a cuddler, as the acceptance on the man's part of barriers, helps them to get to the core of their needs. There's a little boy inside a grown man's body crying out to be understood and just held. Some pros know how to get their clients there. Some feed the superficial misuse of this site by either choosing profits over personal connection. Or letting it act as their pimp. Tragic because many female enthusiasts become collateral damage,
@SirHugsalot4U if you're grown, you shouldn't be seeking therapy from a cuddler. That's putting a ton of pressure on someone who isn't qualified. Men need to take charge of their own mental health. Women don't exist to be the therapists many men refuse to see.
@SpicyNSweet Thank you for totally missing what I said while also becoming a prime example of its truth.
@SirHugsalot4U Be clear, are you saying that pro cuddlers should also be therapists?
I think everyone finds comfort in different ways. I don't want to speak for @SirHugsalot4U, but I believe that is at the heart of his message. If you can find peace in the arms of another, versus sitting on a couch for 50 or 60 minutes in a more formal/traditional therapy session, some would consider that more effective, regardless of how "therapy" has traditionally been defined. Everyone is wired differently so everyone will approach these things differently, in my humble opinion.
I sell pro paid and pro paid accessories.
I'm sorry I couldn't help myself lol.
I'll see myself out.
@pmvines I agree 💯 and i hope others pay attention to what you wrote above.
To me, I feel that Pro Cuddlers are better described as paid Caregivers. They aren’t typically licensed Therapists and most Pros likely don’t want to be treated as Therapists. Listening to Clients inload a lot of emotional baggage is draining and can become depressing over time. Also IMO - ideally Pros shouldn’t be expecting mutual cuddles, I know I never have. I have to add that in the year I changed my status to Enthusiast (for reasons not only connected to CC), I did so partially because I wanted to feel the benefits of being cared for. In some instances I was still treated as if I was in the role of a Pro though I wasn’t charging. Again, all of this is my point of view but I’ve talked to other Pros who feel the same as me.
@Carrie_Anne Thank you ! Yeah I feel like when I see those statements they are primarily made to diminish cuddling as a job and income source, and is usually made by people who are resentful that women don't want to cuddle or spend time with them but don't want to put in the effort or work to find a non cuddle pro friend to cuddle. And I realize not everyone will agree with me on this but I also feel there is low key misogyny because of the expectation that women should not have the ability to make an income, that they should be doing it free of charge, and that they should still carry the brunt of the emotional labor to "fix" them and be their pseudo therapist.
@SirHugsalot4U I am only going to say that using the word pimp when discussing pro cuddlers sort of poisons your overall points. Let’s just say it’s not winning you a lot of points with pro cuddlers on here.
@SirHugsalot4U my reading comprehension is stellar, but thanks🥰 You wrote all that. Not me.
Exactly, @pmvines and @TheFunCartel
@BlueIris I have to disagree with the reason that cuddles aren’t readily free for men is because they aren’t willing to put in the effort. As a guy who actually shares the desire to get to know someone first before cuddling (preferring to even meet up in public once first before getting together to cuddle), revamped my profile several times, tried different ways of sending opening messages, etc., here are my statistics that I took note of after a couple of years on the site before mostly giving up because of the hopelessness it made me feel: 96 messages sent to different people, 74 no responses, 6 became pro mid-conversation without warning (definitely a disappointing feeling when it looks like someone might finally be interested in talking), 3 responded and said they weren’t interested (but were very kind about it), 9 ghosted after one or two messages, I’ve met 3 (cuddled 2 of them), and was stood up by 1. That’s a 2% success rate, and when you’re crafting customized messages based on each user’s profile and there already aren’t a lot of enthusiast cuddlers on the site, that can’t really be described as “readily free”. Don’t get me wrong. I know there are guys like you mentioned who are just super pushy out of the gate and get shut down (deservedly so), but that doesn’t mean it’s working for those of us who aren’t like that.
@BigAndCuddly29 I want to thank you for sharing your experience.
It's very discouraging to try and make connections with others on this site, not be successful, and then repeatedly be told "well that's because you're not putting in enough effort."
Many of us are here for the right reasons, putting in a lot of effort, and trying to find someone to cuddle and connect with, and we are getting ignored for our efforts, and it doesn't feel good. And that's fine, that's no one's fault, just the how the math is mathing.
But can we please stop literally adding insult to injury.
@BigAndCuddly29 I'm here because I've had the same experience on dating sites (sending a couple dozen women thoughtful first messages each month, with extremely poor response) and am trying something different. When I broke up with my last girlfriend a year ago, she actually had to console ME! (I realized at that point I would probably be single forever and couldn't stop crying.) She was very sad that we weren't compatible, but said that I would be fine; and I was such an amazing person that I'd have SO many women after me... Lies!!! I've been in therapy on and off for a couple decades. (Monthly, the last couple years.) I've put in a HUGE amount of work on myself and have made significant positive changes. (OMG! Boundaries are amazing!) I've got a good heart, and I'm doing everything I'm 'supposed' to do; especially just being myself and being respectful. It really seems like it's women that are the problem; but with my anxiety (wonder where that came from?) and the constant rejection, I default to - ME not being good enough. I'm disappointed to see reports that I'll be facing the same thing here. I was expecting better energy from this community... Just keep swimming, I guess; Maybe some physical contact will shift my outlook on life...
It really seems like it's women that are the problem
@MrSnugglesT I am curious why you think that after your ex consoled you when you were crying. I mean do you believe that? Just curious, please don’t take it the wrong way. Everyone blames a group now and then so I am not trying to say you are wrong for feeling that way.
I have found there are women that are a problem but many more that enrich my life or inspire or make me aspire to be a better person by their example. It’s really a mixed bag with the good outweighing the bad. The best we can all do, men and women alike, is to consistently work on ourselves. We really can’t control others and how they react to us.
@TheFunCartel I was referring to the problem of good men struggling to get women to talk to them. There will always be some good women out there like my ex-girlfriend. That's why men don't give up. I would be nice if those women weren't so rare though.
True. Just going to keep working on myself and hope for more good than bad one day...
@MrSnugglesT I get it. But the converse is true as well. There are women who struggle to talk to men. The reasons may be the same or different but these women exist as well. I guess my point is we all carry the burden of humanity regardless of gender. I wish you well in finding a partner.
@MrSnugglesT Someone choosing to not talk to you does not define them as a good or bad person that’s a really weird thing to say.
I’m curious what “better energy” you were hoping from the women in this community over a dating app. Just because people are here for cuddling doesn’t mean they will connect with you or want to cuddle you specifically.
@DCuddlerKing Someone sharing their experience is not a personal insult to you. If it doesn’t apply, let it fly. The reality is the women here are going to have a different experience than the men. Your experience is there is limited response to what you believe are high effort attempts. The women I’ve spoken to here have the experience that the majority of the men put in low effort or inappropriate advances.
@mauvefox Well... when women tell men to put in the effort, so they do, and the women STILL won't talk to them... Then yes, I think that defines them as being a bad person. (Any by "talk to them", I'm not talking about a full-on conversation; I'm talking about not even a SINGLE response.)
The "better energy" I was hoping for, was for women to be more receptive to good men who put in the effort.
I don't understand why this is so difficult. Men WANT to do things for women. That's our nature. We will move mountains for them. But they insist on teaching us that there is nothing that we can do to please them. And then they get upset when we express our frustration.
@MrSnugglesT
Nope. That does not make someone a bad person. That’s still a weird thing to say. And actually kind of tells me a little bit about why people might not be responding to you. But here’s some other potential reasons. 1. Maybe you’re effort wasn’t actually that good 2. Maybe there was something about your profile or message that was offputting 3. Maybe she hadn’t been on the site in a while 4. Maybe she’s new and overwhelmed. 5. Maybe she just didn’t like what you had to say.
You are not owed anything by anyone.
And your attitude here tells me all I need to know about you. You are coming across quite poorly as to your attitude about women and most of us have a 6th sense for that crap. In my experience it is not that men want to move mountains for women. But rather that men feel entitled to women and want to control them. Not all men. But most. And your attitude here would actually lead me to believe you are in that group of most.
If this is the attitude that lies behind your “high efforts,” trust me, it is bleeding through. And they can see it.
@MrSnugglesT Not responding is a choice and while it may be rude, it does not mean they are a bad person. In addition, you said
How is a woman to know that you are good? Just because you verbally engaged with someone does not make you good. Ted Bundy was described as having the gift of gab and being charming, but he was anything but good.
I understand your frustration, but relationships require time, chemistry, and a bit of serendipity.
Blaming women for how you feel.about them not wanting to talk or spend time with you edges towards some kinda dangerous thinking towards both women and yourself. I know it's easy when frustrated to be resentful of the result when the result doesn't go how we want it to, but the "it's all their fault" attitude isn't going to help anything.
I honestly don’t waste time/energy with enthusiasts. I mean yeah it’s great to be able to cuddle for free, but if you’re someone who cuddles only women, I’m just going to go out on a limb and say you have a much better chance finding a free cuddle partner on a dating app or out randomly in person than you do on this site. Women enthusiasts are far and few, most throw up a profile with no description and maybe a single picture and call it a day and the ones who do take the site more seriously eventually become pros because why not make money off of cuddling if you have the opportunity to do so? I mean I don’t dog sit for free because as much as I love dogs, it takes a lot of time and energy (especially when you’re watching a full-sized dog that’s still a puppy). I imagine a lot of people have such heavy energy/baggage that it’s a lot for a cuddle partner to contain. I feel like also if you don’t cuddle pros you’re really missing out because there’s so many amazing pros on the site.
I'm reading through the responses and am getting a theme of entitlement from some. A lot f it reads as "I've checked all the boxes, I should get what I want". But since you're not getting what you want, the only explanation is that women are the problem. Well, some of us are good, just some, how gracious of you. Because you did what you thought we wanted, and you didn't get the desired out come, that justifies you calling us bad people. Women are individual people, with individual wants and individual desires, with individual standards, and individual criteria with what they are looking for. There isn't a one size fits all play book. We all think differently, we all act differently, we all want different things. Each encounter is with an individual who doesn't run on your check list. I get it, rejection is hard. Getting ghosted is frustrating. It happens to the women on this site as well. I deal with it constantly. I move on. I don't blame them, I forget them and move on; I didn't know them before the encounter and my life was fine, so it will be fine after. If you have the "I checked the box, so why can't I get" mentality, you need to check your entitlement.
This comment isn't necessarily directed at anyone specifically, but to quote friend of mine who is a woman on the site , "it amazes me how so many men on the site have such yuck energy and they still blame the women for everything".
When there is so much yuck energy circulating and so much blaming of the other person for not being receptive to the yuck, then it's going to have a negative impact on the whole. That doesn't change the fact that there are still a lot of genuinely decent men on here who are putting in genuine effort to find a cuddle friend. What it does mean is that there are a lot of bad apples and maybe getting mad at the bad apples and trying to be the opposite of that will help you moreso than perpetuating the dangerous attitude that it's the women who are at fault for not being as open to you as you would like them to be.
I'm not trying to be insensitive, and I realize that there are those who will think that I am and that's ok. I'm not here to be a therapist and I'm not responsible for how everybody feels at all times. We are all adults on here , and I refuse to use kid gloves as though we're not.
@mauvefox, I feel like you missed my point. But forget it, I'm not interested in an endless debate on the "most men/low effort" topic as I feel it continues a poor cycle, sorry if I contributed to it going an extra round. I will agree that is factually true, but I don't think it is the reason most men do not get responses.
The true problem (for men hoping to get a response from female enthusiast) is Math
And this is to say no one is necessarily doing anything inherently wrong for a problem to exist. If a guy is putting in effort he is not inherently bad for messaging a woman. And even if a guy is putting in effort a woman is not inherently bad if she ignores his messages.
If I throw a baseball at someone and they don't catch it, we can debate all day and night on whether or not I'm bad at throwing or they're bad at catching. But if I'm throwing a baseball at someone meanwhile 100 other guys are throwing baseballs at the same person, and they don't catch my ball, I am not necessarily throwing poorly, they are not necessarily catching poorly. It's just mathematically, it is unlikely someone would catch my specific ball.
That is what we are dealing with pure and simple. I'll leave it at that. I love you all, happy cuddling.