A little frustrated

MiabearMiabear
in General

Recently, cuddling hasn't been going too well for me. It was GREAT when I started out, but I haven't been meeting any genuine people lately and I was wondering if I was doing something wrong. I feel like many clients don't want to see me again because I object if they try to touch me inappropriately, and I don't encourage sexual tension. All my clients tell me that they had an amazing experience and they loved the "healing power of touch" but I can tell that most of those men are about to go home and jerk off. I wonder if other cuddlers don't mind boners or sexual tension, or if they're doing more than cuddling, because I've lost many of my clients to other cuddlers. A lot of clients have told me stories about sexual encounters with pros from this site. Is there any truth to it? And if there is, then is karma fake?

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Comments

  • TheFunCartelTheFunCartel

    Yes karma can be fake and Santa Claus is fake.

  • MiabearMiabear

    @FunCartel Thank you for your response. I'm a firm believer in Santa Claus and it is so hard for me to wrap my head around the fact that a pro with incredibly amazing karma would be violating the contract and having sex with clients (Based on what I've heard from other clients)

  • TheFunCartelTheFunCartel

    I am not surprised at all. I have had a couple of pros that asked me what they could do to get some really good karma. They danced around the issue but it was obvious what they were suggesting. The two that did that were pretty bad cuddlers to begin with—they seemed to come across as cuddling is too much work.

  • TheFunCartelTheFunCartel

    And also be prepared for the guys coming on the thread telling you that your photos are suggestive and that is why you are having problems.

  • MiabearMiabear

    @FunCartel What do you mean by "the two that did". The two that did what?

  • pmvinespmvines

  • MiabearMiabear

    Oh yes the photos. It's always the photos, isn't it? A photo is too revealing if it shows skin, but they can't understand your body type if you're covered head to toe

  • locomotivelocomotive

    Mia I suggest you explain what you mean by touching you inappropriately..and sexual tension

  • TheFunCartelTheFunCartel

    The two I am referring to asked outright how to get better karma while letting their fingers wander and stopping right at the line of breaking TOS—but they were making their intentions known. I did not take the bait and one decided to go to sleep and not do any actual cuddling the rest of the session. I could not in good conscience report them as they had not crossed the line but they were coming right up to it. This is not my first rodeo, so I know what they were doing.

  • MiabearMiabear

    @locomotive By inappropriate touching, I mean that "accidental" graze across the boobs which happened 10 times in just one hour. And by sexual tension, I mean requesting sex or sexual activities in exchange for more money

  • TheFunCartelTheFunCartel

    @pmvines I stand corrected on Santa Claus. Maybe I will see him at a Dead Kennedys concert moshing to “Too Drunk to F**k.”

  • pmvinespmvines
    edited November 2019

    Slightly change the letters to Santa and you have Satan. They both wear red. And you never see them in the same place at the same place. Coincidence?

  • TheFunCartelTheFunCartel

    I see your logic.

  • [Deleted User]PhilosophyL (deleted user)

    My two cents, Mia, is that this is the attempt to be close with total strangers, and already that in itself has the smack of the online dating scene. I personally don't think any of this should be about sex, but it does cross into odd territory in which there does not exist a clearly defined social norm or dynamic. Everyone's winging it, and the usual cast of sociopaths tend do better at it than those with some more classical thoughts.

    That's said, I'm not a paid cuddler and I'm a 40 year old dude, so take my two cents for what they're worth. I'd say try to meet with and get to know other paid cuddlers and perhaps pick their brains.

    I'll admit that cuddling with a physically attractive partner is a conundrum. Why should attraction mean a thing if this is all about platonic touch? In theory it shouldn't, but there appears to be very little to go on with most of the people in my area that lets me know if they're somebody I'd even vibe with.

    I'd say be prepared to take it slow, find good regulars, and be prepared that the hottest and most personable chicks are going to scoop the easiest pickings.

    I don't mean to make light of your frustration but I've been on this site for about a month, and the odds look pretty crappy unless I pay, which to date I refuse to seriously consider. I'm sure there is a payoff somewhere, but the overhead on my side seems fairly high.

    I'm honestly having better conversations meeting people in real life and chatting them up on other platforms. Shit, I think I'd have better luck platonically fishing on Tinder at this point.

  • [Deleted User]SoftPetals (deleted user)

    @pmvines your Satan and Santa explanation has me dying! 😂😂😂😂
    @Miabear for men to say your photos are suggestive is absurd! Society ia so darn wrong! If I didn't say it out of my mouth dont think that way! That sounds like that same person would be like 'oh you had shorts on so I thought I could slip my hand....' Like Heck No!!!

  • TepelusTepelus

    I don't think there is any issue with your pics or profile

  • [Deleted User]evevanity (deleted user)
    edited November 2019

    You’re not the only one in the same position either. I joined two months ago, and started getting cuddling request frequently because well, these guys wanted to try out the fresh meat and had assumed that I was offering more than just platonic cuddling.

    After cuddling sessions, when I enforce platonic cuddling only, they too disappear. They will book telling you they respect your boundaries and only looking to cuddle, yet push your boundaries in person. I guess word get out that I’m not offering more so I started getting less to non cuddling request. Most will even delete their account when I message them that I don’t offer sexual services. (That’s why I sideye pros who claim to be very booked and busy and can make a living from this—they are most likely offering more than just platonic cuddling)

    80% of men here aren’t honest with themselves and know they don’t want platonic cuddling, they are hoping for sexual encounters. And the sad thing is, they know where to go to pay women for sex. But they all think they are too good to hire escort but want girls who want to offer platonic cuddling to act as escort (the idea is that we are greener, “cleaner” and of course naive). Another reason is our price are low compare to escort prices, so they want buy sex and lowball you by paying you 80-100 when most escort costs a few hundred more. These men know what they’re doing.

    And they wonder why there are less female enthusiastic, no woman in her right mind is going to willingly to put herself at risk of being sexually assaulted for free all in the name of being a cuddle enthusiast.

    Don’t feel bad, it has nothing to do with you but men nature and societal conditioning to push women boundaries. It’s a reflection of them, not you.

  • [Deleted User]SoftPetals (deleted user)

    @evevanity Yes! That happened to me too. So I have some red flags that if I check one off I'm not cuddling with them. There was this one guy that wantes to cuddle naked and I'm like yo get away from me. Lol 💪👊

  • calineurcalineur

    @Miabear I do not believe that Karma is fake, at least not from my perspective. But it may not tell the whole story. Regarding clients going to other cuddlers, it may be a case of a desire for novelty/variety. I have my favorites, but if someone new arrives, I will likely want to cuddle with her even though I still like my favorite.

    Another thing to consider is that those of us who are willing to pay to cuddle may go through phases for whatever reason where we no longer feel the need to cuddle for a while. Or maybe our personalities aren't as compatible as we'd like and that causes loss of desire to cuddle on the part of the client.

    Regarding your other comments regarding comments that you have heard, I am not sure whether an open public forum that restricts said activity will provide you with the answers that you seek. Although I enjoy cuddling for the sake of cuddling, I can understand why not everyone would be satisfied with just that.

    @Miabear I think that your photos are fine, by the way.

    @pmvines funny, but true.

    @PhilosophyL Your comment regarding having better luck on Tinder/Dating/Friends sites may be more correct than we want to admit.

  • [Deleted User]evevanity (deleted user)
    edited November 2019

    @SoftPetals Same here. I cuddle with cancer patient who first insisted he isn’t looking for sex (I thought that is common knowledge, considering the site is for platonic cuddling.) and just needs someone to cuddle with him because he felt lonely and needs touch to feel better. It later turned into him asking me to cuddle with him naked for more money because naked cuddling is a thing and “totally platonic” even though it clearly against the rule. He even asked if he could masturbate right in front of me as we cuddle. I had to give him a stern no. That was very disrespectful.

    Also, as part your screening, watch out for those that ask you ten million question like:
    1. What’s cuddling with you is like. Translational: I hope you will let me touch you sexually.
    2. What cloths will you be wearing:
    Translation: I hope you wear something sexy and skimpy. if sexual assault does occur then it’s your fault for wearing something that says rape me
    3. Do you offer skin to skin:
    Translation: Do you cuddle while completely naked?
    It’s cuddling, our arms and legs will touch, that’s as skin to skin as it will get. Cuddling naked will give them an easier opportunity to touch places that are off limits.

    Generally, they ask a lot of question and give you the run around as if they don’t know what cuddling is and have never seen cuddling or have cuddled before.

  • littermatelittermate

    I am sad and wondering how many of the cuddlers I have lined up are going to be boundary pushers despite their reported interest in platonic cuddling. I WILL REPORT THEM.

  • respectfulrespectful
    edited November 2019

    @Miabear "I haven't been meeting any genuine people lately and I was wondering if I was doing something wrong"

    You are doing everything right! I very much appreciate professionals like you.

    Last Friday I was talking with a professional I see fairly regularly, and we got to talking about boundaries and how relaxing it is when they are clear and you can just let down your guard with the other person.

    As a professional cuddler you are offering something rare and valuable -- platonic intimacy -- and it's awesome of you to do that.

    @Miabear "I don't encourage sexual tension"

    I like that way of saying it. It reminds me of this blog entry at Cuddle Sunctuary, where @HugsFromFei says:

    Our marketing seeks to be exceedingly clear about the platonic nature of our work. We use terms like “affectionate”, “warm”, “nurturing”, “soothing”, “relaxing”, instead of “desire”, “exciting”, “sexy”, “attractive” or “romantic” — see the difference? All this to make sure that we are on the same page regarding what our service entails.

    @Miabear "A lot of clients have told me stories about sexual encounters with pros from this site. Is there any truth to it?"

    It's impossible to know how often that happens, but it seems that way. But sometimes it might just be a form of manipulation to say other pros do.

    The Terms of Service says, "You also agree to never attempt to progress a meeting, organised via this website, to a sexual nature." This is reinforced in the Client Service Agreement and the Cuddler Contract which both say, "No sexual activity is permitted."

    So it's not exactly ambiguous ...

    @Miabear "Then is karma fake?"

    Which kind of karma -- for clients or professionals?

  • dharma1257dharma1257
    edited November 2019

    @Miabear Thanks for this discussion. Sorry to hear what you are going through. You are not doing anything wrong, in fact, you are doing everything right and integrous. Your pics are fine, your profile is good, you are sincere, fair price for NY, good karma, good attitude, etc.

    It is unfortunate that some who offer more are taking clients away from those who are genuine and following the rules and sticking to platonic healing cuddling. But honestly, you dont want to see those guys anyways, who want more, that is not what you are comfortable with. It is unfortunate you are losing clients and losing money, but in the end you will be happier and more at peace and no problems or worries about being kicked off the site or trouble with law, etc.

    There is a thread you might be interested in that explores deeply the question about karma on this site. It is on page two of this general forum, it is titled "How much faith do you place in karma?"

    Thanks again for this honest, sincere discussion on this issue and i hope you continue to prosper and grow as a cuddler and healer.

    p.s. - This is a business like any other and there is going to be competition. You have to find ways to bring in more clients or keep those you have coming back. Some ideas are discounts, half price session after 4 paid sessions, if you recommend a new client 50 % special, certain days are specials that are usually slower have discounts or specials on that day, etc. Be creative and find ways to bring in more clients and to get those you have to keep returning. Legitimate massage therapists find ways to have long term clients and you should be able to do the same with the healing power of touch and cuddling.

  • biancalovecraftbiancalovecraft

    Hey Mia, this happens to all of us, and it seems like it happens in waves.
    There is so much wholesome and sincere love here, but there's also that other element. You know the random guys who dm you on IG... 🙄 they're here too. This isn't a closed community, so any bored, angry, or predatory individual can drop in easily, and play some manipulative games for their amusement.

    The sad part of it is after dodging a wave of the creeps and trolls, we're hyper vigilant, and less receptive to the decent and loveable people who might be struggling to even reach out to one of us.
    When I get one of those waves, I try to bow out, as graciously as possible for a little while. It's really hard to provide a good experience for clients when you're under a psychic attack like that. It will exhaust you, so I recommend you have something else going on. Cuddling under duress shouldn't be a thing.

    Keep yourself safe, and your boundaries Rock solid. What another pro supposedly did has nothing to do with you. Focus on something else until worthy cuddlers show up. There are so many, so be patient and stay open. You dont have to tolerate anything that disturbs your spirit, and you shouldn't ❤️

  • eddie2sweatyeddie2sweaty

    There are a lot of threads bashing men on this site. Some may be bad actors from what I read, but there is also other sides to it. The prices of cuddling most pros are higher than the hourly rate of mental health professionals I have seen, higher than massage therapists, higher then my dentist to clean my teeth. My point being that it isn’t a sustainable model unless the person hiring the pro is either wealthy enough where money isn’t a factor, or believe the person they are paying to spend time with them genuinely cares about their well being. Which I imagine most pros simply view the interaction as a business transaction nothing more, and rarely become friends with their client.

  • [Deleted User]SoftPetals (deleted user)

    @evevanity OMG! That's absolutely disrespectful. Like I get he's sick but that doesn't mean pity goes beyond the rules and your wants. Gross!
    Number 2 just angers me. I am all about ENTHUSIASTIC CONSENT! I have a post on my IG about how RAPISTS RAPE PEOPLE NOT CLOTHES. Additionally what I wear, what I look like is NEVER an ENTHUSIASTIC YES to sex!! People can fetishize a modest dressing woman, children's clothes (so their school clothes were the reason or their darn pull-up?), a woman in a bathing suit! Just because someone is attractive doesn't mean blame goes on them because someone else didn't want to control themselves.
    And omg yes! They act like they never cuddled before. I'm sure they googled it before.

    @littermate and dont hesitate! 💚

  • ReltvlyCanshesReltvlyCanshes

    Question from one of the comments above, could someone sharing that they’ve heard about other cuddlers offering sex to clients for whatever reason just away to introduce the conversation in your dialogue.?Testing the waters and see how it progresses the convo? I’ve heard the same stories but i tend to believe that it was introduced to the convo to see if i was into it, and if i was it would probably go there.

    Side note: as i typed this spell correct changed cuddlers to fiddlers,

  • LovelightLovelight
    edited November 2019

    I think you need to first take some deep relaxing breathes, then write out how you feel, and what you think might be causing this. I am not there with you so, I don't know what you could be doing to make a client, or two "run" away. Perhaps you aren't even doing anything wrong. Maybe your technique and how you handle for example, when a client feels a certain way, can be improved.

    While it's not the duty of a pro to take care of that aspect of a client. It also doesn't help if the pro makes certain faces, makes a huge deal out of, or makes the client feel ashamed of having a natural reaction. Which may or may not be the case with you.

    That aside, keep in mind that no matter how good you are at what you do, not everyone will like you. Not everyone will respect you. Some even book to break the rules: or at least to try to. So don't be so hard on yourself. Let those who will go, and hopefully better will come your way.

    As for them over, over, and over "accidently" touching you inappropriately, I think it's fair that that justifies you walking out of there. You shouldn't put up with that. It might even be a grounds for ban: provided you make a report of it. Other pros/cuddlers might even be dealing with that with these specific men/ so, you'd be helping!

  • calineurcalineur
    edited November 2019

    @FunCartel sounds to me like they weren't cuddlers at all. I did not at first think that cuddling could be difficult, but after cuddling some amazingly affectionate cuddlers and later attempting to cuddle with someone who was not so affectionate, I now realize how varied the experience can be.

  • [Deleted User]MissX (deleted user)

    @Miabear Bianca hit the nail on the head. It comes and goes in waves so don't get discouraged. Btw, your pics are fine. Seems like a lot of discussion lately on that topic. When I first joined the site I had a pic of me in a Santa dress. It was cute but wasn't overly sexy or revealing. Somebody complained and one of the mods asked me to take it down along with another one that had baby girl on it because it could be seen as a fetish. I didn't have a clue, lol. Well turns out the guy that reported me was upset because I told him very nicely that I wouldn't cuddle in the dress. He obviously had bad intentions and ended up banned about a week later. Good riddance.

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