@deathwish posted: "What makes a $100 dollar cuddle better than a $50 dollar cuddle? ... their appearance will be the determining factor."
What cuddlers offer has much more to do with cuddling than with appearance. I've met handsome guys and pretty girls who were absolute limp fish, let alone boring as dirt. The reason we're all here is for cuddle comfort, not eye candy...right?
~ Sunset Snuggles
🦄 Enthusiast 🏞 Travel Fiend 🐘 Animal Lover
@SunsetSnuggles You conveniently left out that part where I said both will claim to be a good time. Just like you said, some people you meet end up being boring or whatever. If I have to pick between two potential pros, and their rates are the same. They’ll both say whatever they can to secure the booking. So I’ll ultimately decide on appearance.
@deathwish I was going to talk about how there's a lot more to go on than rates, but you did say you don't like getting to know people ahead of time, so I guess that would limit your knowledge of whether you have any meaningful interest, or "click" with either of the imaginary Pro's in question. Seems rather like Russian roulette to me, but as you wish.
I'll take a wild stab that the Pro's who can make the biggest difference in your life are not likely to take kindly to being chosen based off their looks. They don't pour their heart and soul into this, or pay hundreds or thousands of dollars to become certified, to be reduced down to who's hotter. But the world is as the world is, nothin' I can do about it.
@SunsetSnuggles deciding by appearance doesn’t necessarily mean I’m choosing who’s “hotter” either. It could be as simple as choosing someone because they’re wearing a shirt of a band I like or something.
@deathwish That's an encouraging clarification. In any case, I hope you have good experiences, here.
@deathwish Men are far more likely to go without touch and cuddles than women for a variety of reasons and I understand wanting what you want when you do have a cuddle session. So you really do not have to explain your preferences as long as they are platonic BUT I wouldn’t divulge the deciding factor of appearance to the woman because it can be seen as objectifying and you don’t want to poison the waters of a potentially great cuddle.
@BoomerSpooner yes, I agree that men are less likely to secure a cuddle. Which is why I cast a wide net, but even then, I’m preselecting who I’m willing to message based off the 3 options of the poll. I’m never preselecting exclusively for 1 option, but it’s when I’m trying to secure a session with the preselected women that I have to evaluate which appeals to me more.
Those determining factors being the rate, the travel, the area, and the 3 options of the poll.
If I have 5 potential sessions, I ultimately have to pick 1 and even then it doesn’t mean I wouldn’t consider the other 4 for another date.
What is this obsession with equating the simple recognition of beauty with objectifying? (i.e. dehumanizing)
Nature has invested tens of millions of years thru evolutionary processes making beauty an important aspect of life. I don't know. Maybe there's something to it.
Is it the only thing Nature did to ensure survival? No. There's having certain cognitive abilities, or rapid instinctive reflexes, and so on.
Is beauty a necessary trait for platonic cuddling? No, of course not.
But every time someone mentions attractiveness, their comment is treated with almost a kind of collective revulsion, like they're promoting cancer or something.
@TxTom its political correctness.
@TxTom Because it's not typically a simple "recognition of beauty". Most girls here can tell you there's a big difference between, "You have a beautiful smile" and "Hey gorgeous". Both imply beauty...with very different tones behind them.
Toss up between bio and Karma, I'd say.
I met two people today who I thought were beautiful. While I thought they were both outwardly attractive to my eye, that to me was far less than the beauty of their souls, which for me is so much more important.
There is absolutely nothing wrong with being handsome or pretty--goodness knows a pretty face has turned my head more than once, lol--but I am finding that when I cuddle someone (and I'm pretty new at this) what makes my heart soar and want to cuddle with them again is their kindness, their caring, and their tender mindfulness.
Their body is simply for me a vessel that allows their real beauty to exist in this world. As Seneca correctly wrote, "... pulchritudine animi corpus ornari," or "the body is embellished by the beauty of the soul."
Have a good evening and good luck, OP, with your cuddling journey. I wish you beauty, friend, and I hope you find what you are looking for.
--Kate
@HarleyGirlKate kind words. Thank you.
@HarleyGirlKate 💯🤌🏻✨️
@TheMidnightOwl Not necessarily “really, really easy” m’lady.
Believe me - there is still PLENTY of flakiness, unresponsiveness, poor communication skills, and worst of all LAST MINUTE cancellation drama while they are on their way to your house with professionals!
Not all of course! But more than one would expect for sure.
There is an obsession? There are literally thousands of posts by women on the forums detailing this over the years that guys leading with comments about the woman’s appearance on a platonic site has commonly been the first step to either grooming the person for extras or simple boundary pushing. In short it has become a red flag for many women. Safety should be an obsession if you are going to be up close and alone with a stranger. Through repeated bad situations women have seen how comments on their beauty has led to the worse possible outcomes and have put it in their considerable large box of red flags to look for in men going forward.
Dismissing how women feel about comments on their appearance potentially leading to at minimum someone they are instantly cautious about is not politics, it is common sense and intelligence based on experience. As someone has already said on here it is how a comment on appearance is presented.
When women repeatedly relate stories about inappropriate comments on appearance leading to sessions where they are groped, forced or even having to leave a session over safety concerns and they continually meet with excuses from men such as “it is natural” or “it is political correctness” it means those men are not listening or they have an agenda. Ultimately it shows a woman that not only is she not being listened to, but her safety and value as a person is being dismissed as secondary to a guy’s bruised ego that he can’t casually do color commentary on her appearance or worse yet, that a simple filter of not saying a phrase that she might consider a red flag is subsumed to some perceived political agenda to protect free speech. Come on guys, introspection and fundamental critical thinking are basic building blocks for true compassion and kindness towards women. You can always go home, look in the mirror and exercise your eloquent words on beauty to the one person who truly appreciates them.
@WestsideMarc I suppose. My point was an attempt to compare to the nonstop complaints from dudes here that they never even hear back from non-pros. Pros are here to make money which is more likely to get one a response, but yeah, people are flakes these days across the board so that doesn’t eliminate the list of issues. But I still stand by my assessment that by and large hiring a pro will lead to more responses and likelihood of actually meeting someone, which appeared as the OPs desire and intention in the first place. It was my way of essentially saying, “Don’t worry, man, just keep trying with pros if that’s what you want cause you’re sure to find one or many.”
And yes to everything @BoomerSpooner said in his last comment. I have a hard time having patience with the lack of perspective taking and empathy by so many men for how fundamentally unsafe nearly every situation can become for women just existing on this planet. It doesn’t require much empathy to just try to understand that women are perpetually fending off sexual advances, especially on this site as it is a perfect avenue for predators to access vulnerable people and situations. If one can’t see that, they’re either incredibly naïve or likely one of the predators...
@TheMidnightOwl I don’t hear of too many people complaining about not hearing back from pros? “I can only hire pros” is definitely a non stop complaint. Anywho my pro response rate is around 50%, which I think is really good. My Enthusiast response rate is way less, maybe 5%? But basically from my perspective it’s like 10 X more likely that a pro responds and probably 30X more likely it leads to a cuddle
@TxTom @deathwish The sensitivity is not aimed at a revulsion of physical appearance but from a revulsion of the all the guys they have to filter through to find a platonic cuddle connection. Immediately bringing up physical appearance is one way for a guy on this site to wave a red flag and make it look like he’s after something non-platonic (whether that’s true or not, when talking to strangers we can only judge them by a limited data). It’s not a bad thing to think that someone has a nice appearance on here, buts better not to bring that into the spotlight so as not to ruin potential platonic connections you can make.
@BoomerSpooner none of what you said doesn’t change the fact that you’re being politically correct towards me about how to approach women. Which is fine, spread the good word all you want but you’re not teaching me anything new.
I don’t appreciate that you’re insinuating I have an agenda, that I don’t listen, or that my ego is bruised simply because I recognize where you’re coming from.
No one claimed to lead with comments about appearance.
I didn’t dismiss any comments about appearances.
@SunsetSnuggles was the only person that was concerned about me bringing up appearances and later said I made an encouraging clarification.
The notion that I might lack empathy or that my little brain can’t comprehend the concept that women have it hard on the internet is insulting.
A creep tells a woman she’s pretty, gets a session, acts creepy and now it’s an unspoken rule that no one can call anyone pretty.
If that’s how you carry yourself, fine. Idc. I already said I don’t like small talk anyway, but regardless of what you said, the Poll reflects that appearances are significantly important.
@deathwish I didn't see that what @BoomerSpooner said was directed at you in terms of saying that this is something you specifically do or what your attitude is . I saw it as more a general explanation into why women might feel a certain way on the site when their appearance is commented on . I don't know what's in your head or your heart, but based on your comments I don't interpret anything you've said as meaning you're only here for the pretty women or for anything non platonic or creepy . Now whether a woman on here might interpret that differently I dunno. But it does speak to your thread topic and title , so it's something you may want to take into consideration.
I agree with others who have said there is nothing wrong with appreciating beauty. 90 percent of my close relationships are with women , and they are all beautiful inside and out for different reasons. And beauty for me at least doesn't have as much to do with physical appearance but rather an overall collection of personality traits and energy and vibe they give . Doesn't mean I'm trying to get in their pants . However, context and dynamic is everything, so if you are hiring an interwebs stranger for a platonic service, and appearance is brought up, I can see their side about it being a potential red flag for sure.
@deathwish I am not being politically correct. I choose not to engage in making comments that might make a woman uncomfortable when I am a stranger to them. There is a difference, just like @SunsetSnuggles said there is a difference in how you say it. I was directing my comment towards a lazy, dismissive comment you made regarding my statement that men should be careful about saying comments on appearances and calling that political correctness. That statement is massively wrong and does not consider context. Saying it to a romantic partner or a really good friend is different from saying it to a stranger that is considering whether or not to cuddle with you in close quarters. Nor did I say no one can say the word pretty, just consider the context. That is not political correctness.
The fact you did not learn anything is typical of most men, as any woman can attest to and I am not shocked by the statement. But again this is not about you it is about what you said and I am not insinuating you are any of those things you are seemingly so hurt by. When women say comments from a stranger about their appearance is a red flag and is why you need to tread lightly with such comments then you say not saying those is political correctness then not listening and everything else that follows is what women often feel. It’s trivializing their plight behind a political slogan, which is sad.
We will have to agree to disagree but accounting for the safety and comfort a woman to whom I am a stranger to is not political correctness.
I don’t know if this is politically correct or not but this song is on my cuddle playlist. I hope I don’t have to remove it.
I tell women "you look good today. What happened?" And never got in trouble for that. One actually went on to provide a serious explenation as to why she thought she looked good that morning.which kinda disappointed me .
My point is that theres a time and a place for (allmost )everything. I agree with the advice to be more careful over here when considering commenting on appearance.
@pmvines when I brought up appearances he felt inclined to tell me not to divulge in appearances being a deciding factor because women will feel objectified. Which is fine.
@TxTom openly asked why is it when beauty (appearance) is brought up that this turns into a sensitivity training. More or less.
I replied that it is political correctness because it simply is.
@BoomerSpooner then quotes me and says,
“Dismissing how women feel about comments on their appearance potentially leading to at minimum someone they are instantly cautious about is not politics, it is common sense and intelligence based on experience. As someone has already said on here it is how a comment on appearance is presented.”
Not a single woman was dismissed in this thread, yet he’s unceremoniously spieling about how women feel for the sake of his virtue.
It was fine until the derail.
@BoomerSpooner something something something beauty is in the eye of the beholder whatever
@deathwish I said we will agree to disagree. You seem to be combative and angry about a perceived slight that doesn’t exist. I wish you well and hope you find peace.
@deathwish You are being defensive when generalizations are being made and no offense being pointed at you specifically. If you are going to bring up topics for discussion on a thread , it doesn't make sense to be defensive when said topics are being discussed . Don't ask what a guy needs to do to get a cuddle if you're not going to be receptive to feedback on that very question that you are asking . It is after all a public forum . If you are taking that personally then perhaps you might want to figure out why .
@BoomerSpooner - I definitely agree with what you wrote here about direct messages. For me, especially being a female cuddler the first message from a potential cuddler, is crucial in determining if I feel safe and curious enough to explore the connection, and a potential meetup.
It helps to weed out people with any creepy/hostile/negative/sexual intentions
Of course people can sadly try and manipulate through words, but the ones I have said yes to have all had a thought through initial message, where they explain why they are drawn to/curious about cuddling/cuddle therapy.
Then it's just about trusting the gut, and learning to read between the lines plus it helps to be a bit of a clever "people reader"
@deathwish
I would heed @pmvines and @BoomerSpooner’s advice here, I believe they are in the minority of male members that don't have trouble finding someone to cuddle. It’s your right to go to an experienced plumber and tell him he’s using the wrong fittings, but you would be missing out on valuable information if you didn’t try to heed their words
Confusing empathy and respect for "political correctness" is a tactic that continually gets used to shut down any discussion on problematic behavior. It's a keyword red flag that despite what the person might claim, they really actually don't give a flying f how other people feel and they'll treat people however they want even if it is harmful. It shows a deep lack of self-awareness as they would rather deny that they are causing harm than have to admit their worldview isn't the only one.
The "golden rule" shouldn't be "treat others how I wish to be treated".... It should be "treat others how they wish to be treated". We wouldn't want people ignoring all our wishes and boundaries and treating us in ways that make us uncomfortable just because they prefer being treated differently - so why the heck would we subject others to that treatment?
People stating they find comments and judgement about their appearance objectifying isn't political correctness. It's stating how they wish to be treated, and ignoring it is violating their clearly stated boundaries. Arguing with them over it is invalidating at best, and leads them to believe that they'll be coerced into violating other boundaries. All folks are doing by being dismissive of "political correctness" is showing that they are not respectful of boundaries and are likely to be unsafe.