General discrimination in cuddletopia

[Deleted User]creedhands (deleted user)
in General

It seems like there are lots of people who have opinions and experiences to share on all sorts of cuddle discrimination. So as not to derail another thread which targets specific discrimination of POC, I thought we should have a more open thread to discuss cuddle discrimination. Some ideas to discuss that I have seen are:
What discrimination you have experienced?
What is the difference between discrimination, racism, and preference?
Why is it bad to discriminate, but ok to have a preference?
Does racism only happen against POC, Asians, and other minorities (statistically speaking), or do those of majority population experience racism as well?
Do hobbits get discriminated against because of their unusually large and hairy feet?

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Comments

  • [Deleted User]DarrenWalker (deleted user)
    edited May 2021

    Ooh, fun, questions.

    Hmm. Well, as I understand it, the difference between discrimination, racism, and preference is as follows:

    Preference is a matter of personal taste. It becomes discrimination when you start excluding people on the basis of something socially loaded, and racism when that something is skin color or culture.

    Why's it bad to discriminate, but okay to have a preference? I'd say what's acceptable and what's not is decided by society. So, for instance....

    Suppose you prefer to cuddle people with XX chromosomes only, and hips, breasts, smooth faces, etc., and the private parts you associate with that. This is a lot of information, some of it private, most of it not even affecting the cuddle! But it's important to a lot of people, and many folks would feel deceived if they learned they weren't, after all, cuddling somebody of the type they prefer.

    This is considered preference—it's okay. Excluding people on the basis of this is fine.

    So if, for example, someone refuses to cuddle with me because they don't know what my chromosomes or private parts look like (or because they do and they don't like it), it's not discrimination. It's preference.

    Discrimination sets in where someone, say, refuses to cuddle anyone whose work is "low class": mail delivery, waste disposal, construction, plumbing, retail, etc. This isn't racism, because they'll cuddle an individual of any race provided they're a lawyer or a doctor or something.

    Racism is discrimination on the basis of race: skin color, facial features, accent, linguistic quirks, preferred foods, physical build, etc.—anything the person doing the discriminating ties to race.

    While it's technically possible for a white person in America, let's say, to be discriminated against on the basis of race, it seems intellectually dishonest to use the same word for this that we do for discrimination against the non-white in America: a white person who gets turned down for one job because their name's too Caucasian lives in a country where, at a majority of jobs, their application will be prioritized for the same reason.

    Technically, it's racism—it is discrimination on the basis of race. But the racism a white person in America might face is so slight compared to the racism a POC in America faces that using the same word to describe both seems... misleading.

    And now to reload the page and read the 23 comments that probably posted here while I was typing this ridiculously long thing!

    Edit: ...Ah. Ahahaha. I still beat everybody.

    Well, in that case I'll answer the last one! Hobbits don't have unusually large and hairy feet. Does everyone else have unusually small and naked feet? Who decided the hobbit foot wasn't usual, anyway? Was it humans? Are humans trying to make themselves the default again? Geez. And why do we even need a default?

    (Yes, I'd guess that they are discriminated against due to their feet... but only by rude people.)

  • Ahmedali999Ahmedali999

    I think 99.99% they discriminate the way I look except professional don't because they like money

  • [Deleted User]DarrenWalker (deleted user)
    edited May 2021

    @Ahmedali999: Uh. Looks, you say. Based on your main profile picture, I wouldn't be surprised to hear that people were refusing to cuddle you because you're too pretty and they're afraid they wouldn't be able to keep it platonic.

    More seriously, your profile could use a bit of editing. Mind if I message you some suggestions?

    Edit: Oh, your account's muted. So much for that. Hmm....

    You start out saying that you're single and looking to cuddle a woman. This can easily be read as "I don't have a girlfriend and I'm looking for one"—not what the site's for, and likely to scare enthusiasts off. I'd cut the relationship status and make what you're looking for plural, so it's clear you're not after a gf.

    Next you explain what you like in a cuddle, which is excellent. I'd rephrase it a little for clarity, but otherwise: perfect.

    You describe yourself in terms I find kind of confusing (more rewriting needs to be done here, I think), then talk more about the kinds of cuddling you like. I'd move all the "this is what I like in a cuddle" stuff to the same spot.

    Then you finish up by talking about a couple people you've cuddled and how much you appreciate them—nice, but more suitable as karma on their profiles than as part of yours.

    I can correct specific spelling errors as well, if you like.

    Having a clear and readable profile really helps with getting responses! If, after all that, people still don't respond, well... then it might be your looks.

    Second edit... I might also note that, in English, mercy is compassion or forgiveness shown toward someone whom it is within one's power to punish or harm. So, uh. Maybe don't use that word on your profile for a cuddling website, because telling people it's within your power to punish or harm them (but you're merciful, and won't) isn't exactly comfortable and cuddly. Bad connotations there, in English.

  • UKGuyUKGuy

    The most common form of discrimination in the cuddling world is based on age. It's even condoned by this website since there is an 'age preference' in the profile questions. As for other forms of discrimination, there are many. However, I don't classify a personal preference for one race over another as racism. I believe racism has to have as it's basis the belief that one race is superior or inferior to another and thus incapable of competing with another. Consequently, I would classify all forms of racial division or racial quotas as racism. The definition of racism is constantly being widened in order to sow divisions in society. A divided society is much more easily controlled and influenced than a united society.

  • panda619panda619

    The only color that matters is green.

  • sunnysideupsunnysideup
    edited May 2021

    @DarrenWalker nice response, where do you think ageism fits in (I’ve been told by a cuddler they didn’t want to cuddle me on account of my age). Or what about filtering based on attractiveness (provided you intend on a platonic cuddling relationship only)? And there have been a lot of loaded threads lately maybe that’s why this one didn’t explode with responses.

    There are also political leanings and even religion that some people filter by.

    Agree with Darren that what differentiates discrimination and an acceptable preference is largely social. Part of it is based on the perceived relevance to cuddling. It is not okay to discriminate based on sex when hiring an employee for your company. But it is totally acceptable when looking for a cuddle partner.

    In the dating world, it seems like having a racial preference is considered okay by society based on how some dating apps have a racial filter and there are dating apps for different ethnic groups.

    Based on the definition of racism white people can definitely experience it. However it is not likely to be a pervasive issue unless they are in the minority. For instance if a white individual from America and moved to a Country where whites are in the minority might experience a lot of racism when looking for a job.

  • amandajaneamandajane

    DarrenWalker,
    You really are such a clever person & I do so enjoy when I come across your comments in different threads🌞
    You have a lovely talent to put forward nicely salient points & to clarify things in wonderful, rational ways. Thank you 🙏

  • ZacRedBearZacRedBear

    I've mostly discriminated via name calling/reticule by blue collar men for having an office job, and by city folk for my general, cultural ignorance. Nothing that bothers me much anymore, especially compared to serious hate crimes.

    The only time I was racially discriminated against (that I know of), is when I was talking to a friend about a movie, and a nearby Black man disgustingly asked, "Why are _you _watching Roscoe Jenkins?" I laugh about it now, but in the moment, I truly felt hurt with guilt and a feeling that I didn't belong anywhere near this man or even the city in general. I brushed it off quickly enough when I compared it to much more severe racial discrimination, and my friends that were present. It was still an eye opener that anyone I meet of any background or appearance could encounter casual discrimination like this (and much worse) on a daily basis.

    Why preference is okay: I prefer pineapple pizza, but I won't discriminate this peperoni pizza in front of me.

    I'm ashamed to say I have yet to offer a foot rub to any hobbit.

  • xandriarainxandriarain

    @sunnysideup Age discrimination is very common on this website. I am lucky to be young for now. However a few times I’ve had older clients turn me down because they wanted someone closer in age to them. If you look at the profiles he will often see far more pro accounts in 20s and 30s and not so many in the 40s and beyond. I do you know of one cuddler who Is quite successful in her 40s but she does not get that many clients off of this website and has to market herself a lot. It would be interesting to see how many bookings older professional cuddlers get and if they can actually earn a living in their 40s 50s and 60s.

  • Ahmedali999Ahmedali999

    @DarrenWalker
    Thanks for your response
    Many they judge my look they think I'm scary,criminal or pervert or maybe I look boring I already edit my profile thanks for your support

  • sunnysideupsunnysideup
    edited May 2021

    @xandriarain Interesting. You are right that most of the profiles of professionals do seem to be in the 20s or 30s. For what it's worth, I have reached out to a couple professionals in my area (ish) that were in their 40s but they all declined cuddling with me, but this might have more to do with large amount of cuddle unprofessionals on here as discussed in another thread.

  • _marC_marC

    @DarrenWalker thank you for that explanation! I love how you really ❤ make it easy for anyone to understand. I hope you find many cuddles and much happiness 😍

  • CatloafCatloaf
    edited May 2021

    I’m speaking from the perspective of being both a pro, and an enthusiast.

    I have a feeling I get discriminated against for having adult acne which is nearly always hyper pigmented, and so easy for me to get with Type 1 (2? 3? I don’t even know anymore, I’m pale with pink and olive undertone) combination skin. I have a compulsion with picking my skin as well unfortunately (thanks anxiety), though it’s gotten better over the years. I’m past the point of using makeup to hide it because it really doesn’t and it’s terrible for my skin. I can’t control it, and I follow a strict skincare routine. It would be much, much worse than it is here if I didn’t. I’ve been 99.8% cosmetic free for 2-4 years now and while it’s helped, I feel like I get passed up a lot for not looking “put together” enough. Styled to the nines like other, more successful people on here are. I guess I just don’t care about external appearances as much as others. I accept my thinning frizzy hair (which, yes, it’s brushed), my bad skin, my unruly and barely there brows, my teeth (the reason I am never grinning big in my photos, because it is my biggest insecurity - I promise I’m not mean IRL, lol). I also feel like I get judged, or passed on a lot for not having a full body photo. Sorry, I have no full length mirrors in the house, I detest doing bathroom selfies, and none of my roommates or friends want to spend 2-3 hours trying to get a good shot of me. My ex used to do my photos from time to time to a standard I loved and would be happy to do more, but we’re in different provinces now. Maybe this summer when I visit Calgary. His photography wasn’t expert or anything but he always captured a side of me I loved.

    I’m sort of salty about it, but at the end of the day, people can discriminate against these things if they want. After all, the poll that was posted elsewhere did list attractiveness as the top factor for who people choose to cuddle with. For a lot of society, the way I look is construed as not taking care of myself, thus not physically attractive. I’ve had this pointed out to me in IRL jobs as well, where male candidates were not held to the same standard (and they shouldn’t be). Truth is, I have flaws that I no longer have the energy to hide, and I do take care of myself. I just do it differently.

    Here’s a photo. And this is a relatively good skin day. A request: do not comment on my appearance here or PM me about it - I accept any positive energy you send to me mentally. I am only putting this here because I know there’s got to be a lot of others out there with skin like mine or with the same thoughts about how we look, who are afraid or feeling unworthy and I just want you to know I see you.

  • [Deleted User]DarrenWalker (deleted user)

    @amandajane and @craM, making me blush. Thanks, guys!

    @Ahmedali999: Hopefully your profile edits will pull in some good cuddlers. As for the people who judge you by your race—well, racists don't typically make great cuddle buddies anyway, do they?

  • CuddleDuncanCuddleDuncan Mod
    edited May 2021

    I don't want to disagree with @DarrenWalker's excellent post. However, I see the difference between discrimination and preference as being primarily one of relevance.

    If the characteristic is relevant to the activity, then it's preference. If it's not relevant, then it's discrimination.

    This is easy to say, and a lot of the time it's easy to implement. But of course real life is more complex than that. Social factors (as DarrenWalker suggests) definitely play a part. Car insurance companies discriminate on the basis of age: and it is, unequivocally discrimination. But that is socially permissible, partly because it is defensible on a statistical basis. A professional cuddler mentioned the same thing on here the other day - she doesn't see men below a certain age, because she's fed up of dealing with the hassle that many young men are. Statistically, nobody would argue - lots of young men are a nightmare. But I was an impossibly polite and respectful young man, as were most of my friends, and as are many of my students.

    There is a lot of age ... differentiation on Cuddle Comfort (CC). Is that preferance or discrimination? Well, it's both. Having hard and fast age-based rules is discrimination. (I've seen fiftysomething men specify 18-32. For cuddle buddies! Actually that's not discrimination, that's delusion, or nascent abusiveness.)

    But it's reasonable for an older client, seeking a certain level of emotional support from their cuddle therapist, to favour more mature professionals. For example, it's not reasonable to expect a 19 year old to give me the emotional support I need, they just haven't had the chance to gain the life experience required. However, it turns out that it can be (and is) done by professionals in their late twenties. (For the avoidance of doubt, yes I have hired very young professionals and yes they were happy experiences.)

    Age is not relevant to the specific matter of the physical cuddle. But it is broadly relevant to the whole cuddling experience.

    @xandriarain some years ago a lady who was a sex worker and madam rose to a certain level of fame here in the UK. Later in her life, somebody decided to make a TV documentary about her. They found her living in a cottage in the country, keeping chickens and with an endless stream of customers. If sex workers (and accountants, and politicians) can succeed in their 50s and 60s, I don't see why cuddlers can't.

  • [Deleted User]squeakytoy (deleted user)

    @Catloaf It's incredibly sad that you would be judged for that! It's not the first time I've heard of this, unfortunately - I've known women who went out without makeup on a day they were having an acne outbreak, and got a ton of unsolicited skincare advice from complete strangers :sweat:

    I'm fanatical about my skincare routine, but like... pimples still happen sometimes. You have one stressful day, you eat something greasy, you lean on your hand or scratch your face without thinking, and poof. There they are! It would be amazing if we could just show our faces to the world as they are, without it being an automatic invitation for critique.

  • xandriarainxandriarain

    @catlof I don’t know if this will help at all but I don’t see pimples as a flaw but more an opportunity to do my favorite activity. I get so excited when I see a juicy pimple its like every pimple is a present waiting to be opened or popped in this case.

  • CatloafCatloaf
    edited May 2021

    @xandriarain Exactly part of my issue!...you simply must join the “Poppers” subreddit if you haven’t already. 🤣 I follow it and oddly enough I think it’s helped me become a less damaging and frequent “picker”. That’s my dirty little secret and people think I’m bonkers for it.

    @squeakytoy You know the worst part of that? And I’m sure you’ve come across them. Those skincare MLM type stores in malls that have associates standing outside who want you to try the product...oh, they’d do their darnedest to try and rope me in. And every time I told them: my skin may look terrible to you, but I’m confident enough to go to a dermatologist for proper care if I want it...rather than have you stand here and passively aggressively imply my face looks like I do drugs when you ask in a false concerned tone why my acne is so red and scabbed.

  • [Deleted User]Mmart (deleted user)

    @Catloaf
    I was touched by your post. I am not one who gives a hoot about physical appearance. Your post showed a lot of depth and strength which are two of my favorites in people. I hope you continue to be you and the heck with anyone else's thoughts. Happy cuddling.

  • CatloafCatloaf

    @Mmart 🥰

  • Ahmedali999Ahmedali999

    @Catloaf
    You should be glad about yourself me I messaged more than 100s people don't respond

  • CatloafCatloaf
    edited May 2021

    I don’t want to keep taking away from this thread, my intent was just to share my experience and be a silent beacon for others to share theirs. I’m not going to comment anymore @Ahmedali999 but I will say the following to you, and anyone else who tells us ladies or others to be more grateful:

    Although I’m female (and we get way more attention than guys do, on any social site), I don’t get as much attention on this particular site as you’d think. My inbox is usually only filled up with 3-4 messages at the most. I highly doubt it’s because of my boundaries all the time, and the fact that I don’t host (because even when I did, my bookings didn’t really improve much). I have affordable pricing. I have been a pro cuddler for approaching 5 years now, and I want to seek training to help legitimize this industry. In some way it has to be part personality; I can seem quite abrasive and intense, but that’s just who I am mentally and how I write - it’s not who I am at the heart/emotional level. People (male or female) who are deemed by society systemically to be “less physically attractive” are always going to get the short end of the stick because - let’s not be naive -a significant amount of people won’t want to go deeper than cuddling with someone who matches their desired physical ideal. Most of my repeat clients are in my old city, and they didn’t find me here, they found me through my Wordpress and ads elsewhere because they were specifically looking to be held - not snuggle up to a pretty woman (not that there’s anything wrong with that). I serve and appeal to a very small, niche group of people. I’m learning to be okay with that.

  • sunnysideupsunnysideup

    I had pretty bad acne growing up, and while it has cleared, it has left scars on my face. I'm hoping when I get more money that there is some type of medical procedure to get those healed or removed somehow.

  • [Deleted User]creedhands (deleted user)

    @Catloaf don't feel like your comments are off subject. Totally fits in with the whole discrimination/ preference talk.
    For the record, I would absolutely cuddle you if it wasn't for the pesky 300 plus miles (and lack of passport). Your personality shines in your posts and bio, your price is right, and your interest in bringing the cuddle industry to social acceptability is admirable. And your cats are cute.

  • CuddleDuncanCuddleDuncan Mod

    @Ahmedali999 I know you're miserable and I feel for you, I really do. And part of being an ordinary guy in the modern world is that that most of your messages to women online will not be answered. But getting an occasional one to answer is something that can be learned. It's more than a simple skill, because it involves a proper (and potentially difficult) look at yourself. It takes time. But it can be done. I did it.

    It is tough to learn because the time you need to learn it is when you are already at the bottom. But you've posted several times now, and that's enough to get your started. Read the advice here, and do it. You've already kindly said that you'll do some of the things I have suggested, which is a great start. As Churchill said, "When you're going through hell, keep going."

  • [Deleted User]squeakytoy (deleted user)
    edited May 2021

    @Catloaf Oh man, I haven't visited that particular subreddit in a long time! It used to be such a guilty pleasure.

    [Spoiler: the following is disgusting, do not open if you're squeamish]

    I mean it, this is disgusting! Don't open if you're squeamish. I won't be held accountable if you do.

    Final warning.

    My favorites were Dr. Pimple Popper's videos where she cut open sebaceous cysts and abscesses and squeezed out all the thick, curling, toothpaste-consistency pus and rot. :relaxed: It was glorious and so satisfying to watch!!

    Re: Those damn skincare MLM folks, I know exactly what you mean!! But even having a clear skin day doesn't keep them away. :tired_face: They just block your path, exclaim "oH yOu HaVe SuCh NiCe SkIn", and go on to say they have such-and-such luxury pampering products for skincare enthusiasts, yada yada. They're freakin' relentless, they have a line for everyone, young and old, men and women, etc. I join you in despising them.

    To add to the main topic: I don't feel like I've personally experienced discrimination as far as cuddling goes in this community, but I feel for those who have. I know I have really strict filters on who I choose to meet up with IRL (for safety's sake) but I'd like to think they're more based on preference than prejudice, at least based on the @DarrenWalker Definitions (TM).

  • Ahmedali999Ahmedali999

    @CuddleDuncan
    Thanks Duncan I have been doing it for years using pof dating website also 8 months on here still never worked but I will follow what u sent me before

  • JacobShadzJacobShadz

    As someone who has gained a decent amount of weight over the last few years I have seen my profiles on sites outside of this one (only just found CC) drop a ton in messages and responses when I reach out.
    I feel that weight and looks tends to be the first thing people look at especially on Male profiles since they are usually in excess so it tends to seem that overweight guys are first to get cut out.
    Now that is just my own experience but it is something that kinda sucks, its made finding anyone for anything that much harder.

  • [Deleted User]creedhands (deleted user)

    @JacobShadz I am an overweight guy as well but I have not experienced discrimination based on that. In fact, I have had cuddlers tell me they prefer cuddling guys my size because we are more comfy. As I have lost a bunch of weight lately, I actually had a couple cuddlers complain that I've lost too much, even though I'm still bigger than most guys. I don't think you will find much trouble being a bigger size guy here.

  • CuddleJay02CuddleJay02

    @DarrenWalker
    😂 For the record, I’m a plumber and have never been discriminated against. In fact, more than one Pro has bartered with me (plumbing repairs for cuddles).

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