**So it's not perverted for a man to see an undressing woman and have sexual thoughts, so long as he saw her accidentally and doesn't act on his thoughts?
I want to be very sure I understand you.**
Yes.
I never said most older men are dogs.
My last response to this baiting forward/reverse nonsense, I swear. You didn't say, per se, but your statements do imply. That is an indirect way of saying.
No, I don't think there is anything wrong with that. As long as he doesn't act on his thoughts.
Heh. So, I suppose you're okay with the guys who get boners during cuddles and keep thinking about what they'd like to do with someone who they've met up with, even if they're not acting on it? No efforts to refocus or anything, mind you. It's all good as long as the other person isn't being humped or penetrated. You don't find that creepy? I find that pretty effin' creepy, and I'm very adept at being able to tell when someone is towing the line so to speak.
I never implied it. I don't care what others do. My life will be great either way.
Heh. So, I suppose you're okay with the guys who get boners during cuddles and keep thinking about what they'd like to do with someone who they've met up with, even if they're not acting on it? You don't find that creepy? I find that pretty effin' creepy, and I'm very adept at being able to tell when someone is towing the line so to speak.
No, I think that's creepy. Sexual gratification on your own is different than thinking about it while cuddling with somebody.
@rj88: Okay!
So if a man has no intention of doing anything to create sexual thoughts (like seeing a woman undress), but unfortunately something happens (like he walks into a room at the wrong time), it's not perverted—even if he has sexual thoughts—so long as he doesn't act on them?
**@rj88: Okay!
So if a man has no intention of doing anything to create sexual thoughts (like seeing a woman undress), but unfortunately something happens (like he walks into a room at the wrong time), it's okay—even if he has sexual thoughts—so long as he doesn't act on them?**
Yes, that's my opinion. This also goes for woman seeing men.
@rj88: Even if he's deliberately put himself in a situation where he knows it's likely he may accidentally walk in on an undressing woman (that is, he's decided to share living space with them)?
That's completely different if somebody does something deliberately to see a person undressing.
@rj88: So when you decided to share living space with a woman (knowing that this meant it was now possible that you might accidentally walk in on her undressing), you became a pervert?
They were my friends from college. I didn't share an apartment with them to see them in their bras. That thought never occurred to me. We each had our own rooms. She only took off her shirt in the den because she got a spot on her shirt and was late for work and needed to change her shirt . Have you ever had roommates? Things happen. We both laughed about it because we were embarrassed and went to work.
@rj88 says,
That thought never occurred to me.
Things happen when you're roommates that don't happen when you're not. Choosing to be roommates means choosing to make it more likely that those things will happen.
But if those things aren't your goal, then it's not perverted to put yourself in a situation where they're likely to happen?
I’ve reconsidered my personal position about all this.
Prior to this my own rule of thumb was the “Half + 7” Rule, if for no other reason than that our society is full of loonies who project their own predatory thoughts and personal perversions onto others.
I also, quite unfairly I realize, simply assumed that someone who was 18 would have no common ground with me, making it difficult to be comfortable with them.
But I’m beginning to think that having so little common ground with a young professional might be a positive thing.
It might free me from my conditioning to feel I have to be a comfort to them while they provided comfort to me.
Our lack of commonality could allow me to simply let them practice their calling, without my hang ups and barriers.
And, in a longer term sort of way, my presence as an entirely respectful, platonic, and safe older man might be the good experience they need to work through any qualms they might have had.
Thanks @rj88!
You’ve given me a lot to think about.
I think if you all ignored rj88 then he may go away ?
**Things happen when you're roommates that don't happen when you're not. Choosing to be roommates means choosing to make it more likely that those things will happen.
But if those things aren't your goal, then it's not perverted to put yourself in a situation where they're likely to happen?**
Well they actually found the three bedroom apartment and asked me if I needed a place to live. Coincidentally I was looking for a place, so we lived there for 2 years.
I am not sure how you infer that any of us were perverted? LOL
@izzabelle
Hi. I hope you're doing well.
@izzabelle: But I don't want him to go away. I'm learning things.
@CharlesThePoet
I'm not sure if you were being serious or not, but you're welcome.
I love when you guys dog pile like this. I'm just like, basking in my own limited emotional maturity rn. On that subject! The way you verify is the same way the store does when I get my periodic booze haul. You card em. Like getting carded for 7 bottles of wine when you're well into your 30s, It's kinda awkward, and they may not like it, but it's much less awkward than finding out that you cuddled up a person who is LEGALLY INCAPABLE OF CONSENT. Like there would be no good way to get that news after the fact. so definitely do that if you must cuddle baby face, which I have a few times after plenty of discussion in an attempt to gauge maturity. I liked it! MAMA 😂 lol whatever that says about me 🤷♀️ But I'm very glad I wasn't on cuddle comfort when I was 18.
[deleted because no point in adding my thoughts]
So you decided to share living space with two women, which increased the odds of you seeing a woman undressing.
Seeing a woman undressing wasn't your goal, though. If it had been, you would have been a pervert—but it wasn't, so you're not.
It's not perverted to put yourself in a situation where you may experience something that might trigger sexual thoughts and/or feelings, so long as that's not your goal (and if it happens, you don't act on any non-platonic thoughts or feelings that may occur).
Right?
I don't intend to imply anything about you: I really am just trying to make sure I understand.
**So you decided to share living space with two women, which increased the odds of you seeing a woman undressing.
I don't intend to imply anything about you: I really am just trying to make sure I understand.**
LOL I don't need to be roommates with women to accidentally see a women undress.
For all we know they were the perverts and hoping to see me naked. LMAO!!!!!
Nobody can control how they feel. Men get boners when they cuddle and women get wet when they cuddle. It happens. As long as the man or woman doesn't act on those feelings, then there is nothing wrong with natural feelings.
I don't need to be roommates with women to accidentally see a women undress.
No, but it does increase the odds. Not that that matters! Experiencing something that might turn you on wasn't why you moved in with those women. You didn't even think about the increase in probability.
That's why you're not a pervert, yes?
It's completely non-perverted to do something that increases the odds of you getting turned on so long as that's not your goal, and you're not going to act on it even if it happens.
simply assumed that someone who was 18 would have no common ground with me, making it difficult to be comfortable with them
This line of thought seems to be fairly common but it's one I've never understood. I've never actually cuddled an 18 year old from this site, but I have cuddled people who aren't too much older than that, and I think it's interesting and enlightening to share our different perspectives on things. It's not like young people are aliens who I can't relate to on any level.
**No, but it does increase the odds. Not that that matters! Experiencing something that might turn you on wasn't why you moved in with those women. You didn't even think about the increase in probability.
Right?**
I've had about 8 female roommates over the last 13 years. They have all been great experiences. I didn't room with them so I could possibly see them without clothes on.
Men get turned on. Women get turned on. It's natural and it's nothing you should ever be ashamed about.
@rj88: Yes. That makes sense to me.
Even if you'd been 65 and those two women had been 18, you wouldn't be a pervert for sleeping in a separate bedroom and sharing rent.
You didn't agree to live with them because you hoped you might see them deshabille.
That thought didn't even occur to you.
It's not perverted.
A man (even an old man) can put himself in a relatively intimate position with a woman (even a young woman) without it being perverted. It's easy. All that's needed is for him to A not have sex on the brain, and B have self-control.
It's so easy to be platonic! Almost anybody can do it!
@DarrenWalker ~ 👏👏👏 and @rj88 ~ Thank you both for sticking with it so we could all understand!
:;Added:: It all seemed so complicated and heated for a bit. But look at that! Mutual understanding (and now it all totally makes sense)! 😁
That's fine.
**A man (even an old man) can put himself in a relatively intimate position with a woman (even a young woman) without it being perverted. It's easy. All that's needed is for him to A not have sex on the brain, and B have self-control.
It's so easy to be platonic! Almost anybody can do it!**
Well of course it's easy to be platonic. Not everything is about sex. Men and women can be friends without having sex.
Agreed! That's what this site is all about: adults of all ages being friends. Even if other people think it must be sexual, we know it's not, don't we? It's nice to be able to make friends with old people, young people—to snuggle up and say "you're pretty cool, bro."
Some people might look at you living with two women, or at an 18 year old cuddling a 65 year old, and think sex must be happening, that it's perverted somehow.
It's awesome to be able to look past that and see that no, this isn't perverted at all.
**Agreed! That's what this site is all about: adults of all ages being friends. Even if other people think it must be sexual, we know it's not, don't we? It's nice to be able to make friends with old people, young people—to snuggle up and say "you're pretty cool, bro."
It's awesome to be able to look past that and see that no! not everything is about sex.**
I still don't think 65 year old men should be cuddling 18 year old teen girls, but that's just me.
@rj88: Yup! It's just you. 🤗
@DarrenWalker
I didn't mean "that's just me" meaning I'm the only person who thinks this way. I mean "that's just me" meaning that's my opinion. If we talked to 1,000 people I can guarantee you the vast majority of people would say that 18 year old teen girls shouldn't be cuddling 65 year old men.