@Warmlyhearted I can agree on the last two points. There's more to debate, but I think we're on similar pages. Cheers.
People are people. Everyone is different. It’s great to meet different people and find out about them. I had majored in communications and love talking to people. Can you imagine what the world would be like if everyone looked the same? I have not been lucky enough to be able to hook up with a lot of female coddlers. A lot of my messages usually go unanswered. I take that as not interested. Not certain if maybe it’s an age thing. I was lucky enough to meet up with one that was a great experience. And I know that sometimes schedule conflicts do get in the way as well. It’s tough when you don’t have enough free time. Oh well, I keep trying and trying. Hopefully it will work out again some day. I really miss hugging as that has really disappeared in my life…
I didn’t plan on chiming in but here are my 2 cents as a poc..
You profile says you don’t host as you’ve listed “Guest”.
(Edit: you have 2 reviews.. so that’s a multiple..
Old comment: You only have 1 review from a cuddler and not multiples as you pointed in the original post. )
Your pics are outright serious looking in black and white. Not a single smiling one. You’re kissing wine bottle for someone that lists drinking “rarely”. Contradictory. There was an element mentioned in your profile earlier today that is edited out as of now. That in itself was a red flag for me reading it as a guy. So who knows what else was in your profile leading up to this point.
And of course the other basic variables like proximity, age, the cuddlers’ personal preferences, their availability, etc. and stuff that we can’t see such as the way you worded your messages to them, how often. So yeah multitude of factors.
But straight out essentially playing race card.. not cool.. I’m not invalidating your concern but I don’t see merit in validating it either.
As also a POC, I'd like to say that one member of a group cannot invalidate the experiences of another, bc they're different. At the moment, only about 6-10% of the world's population (7.837 billion) is of European descent (roughly 800 million unless my math is off).
So if there are 6+ billion POCs, surely we are not a monolithic group - even among Asians, there are different cultures, different regions (South, southeast, east), and different social issues. Even the term POC is kind of problematic bc its a term that represents over 90% of the world's population and is a stand in term for "not European."
I think his experience as an African American man in New England differs from your experience as an Indian person in India or visiting the states. In particular, you live somewhere in which you are the majority. There are a different set of stereotypes and social issues and systemic problems that follow each group (and particular to the country).
To be honest, I think both of your profiles are well thought out and seem cuddle friendly. Personally, I think folks are harshing on his profile a bit too much- it's about 10x better than most men who complain about their lack of cuddles (they usually have no pictures, no summaries, and an an attitude problem, yet many pple offer them lifelines). Okie doke.
I think pple are being harsh bc they want to believe that this society is a meritocracy, so rather than admit a harsh truth, they're looking to fault the individual (not the system) for the lack of cuddles. That's my two cents.
Have a good day ya'll.
Edited for content [reurbo]
@jabraham96
First i want to acknowledged that i see what you are saying. I want to say what you are saying is happening is happening to an extent, probably in most cases. The way you feel is the same way i feel, i run through my mind all the time, are my words conveying a message differently than i intended. Should my pictures be more pleasant. Blah blah blah. You’ll get advice on how your profile, pictures and all of that might help. All that advice is good and coming from a good place, but i want you to know it is happening. There is no doubt.
FYI to all those who are reading this words like “preference” in this context is deflecting and disingenuous, I’m also coming to believe is disrespectful. It’s directing all the answers to this mysterious no tangible, non fungible thing that can never be defined. But anyway.
@jabraham96 Secondly i want to say, young man unfortunately in this world you’re going to build that tough skin that many assume we are born with. That bullet proof brown skin that at any moment could turn into a violent and sex crazed wild animal. Let’s face it there are very few places in this world that are not in someway going to show you how the world feels about you. And mentioning it and asking about is not playing the race card, it’s recognizing what’s happening and discussing it to come to an understanding of why it’s happening, why you feel this way and why do people think like this. I think it’s a mental or psychological defect everyone suffers from a little bit(we are not excluded). Because that’s what the world shows all of us.
You feel what’s happening, you’re not making it up you’re not being sensitive. It is absolutely happening.
Everyone wants to believe they are open minded and woke or whatever they are calling it these days. And some may be but if they were truly honest they are saying what they aspire to. I’ve come to believe in 80% of the instances you feel are probably unintentional, but i know that doesn’t make you feel any better.
I’m sayin all this so that you know, i recognize what you are feeling. It is real. I know from having this type of conversation for many years of my life, with many well intentioned people. I’ve come to see that in defense of who people believe they want to be, simply explain away behaviors they have and don’t want to believe has anything to do with race, color, hue or tint. It’s a defense mechanism.
But know this NO ONE can explain away your perception of what’s happening to you. That type of behavior would not be tolerated if we were talking about any other thing. Not age, height, weight, left handedness, sexual orientation even allergies. If someone would try and explain why what a trans person is feeling is not happening, that talk gets corrected immediately. But, i don’t want to go down another road of discrimination or compare struggles because they are all real.
I said too much, sorry guys. But @jabraham96 it is because you are black. But because you are black you know how to maneuver, so you don’t need to entertain “it’s not as bad as you think.” It’s worse. The ways it’s worse is tangible and measurable. There’s history and data points, it’s record of human behavior going back to the beginning of recorded history.
I’m sorry if anyone takes any offense. I wish i could explain it in away that isn't abrasive to you. That was the best i could do on short notice.
If i was completely open and honest about how i feel about it, it sound much worse.
And if you find yourself thinking of ways to prove what I’m saying isn’t correct, please ask yourself why you feel the need? If you feel the need because what i said could pertain to you ask yourself why you think the behavior described pertains to you AND why you need to tell me or anyone else why it shouldn’t make me feel the way it does.
It can’t be facts, so let’s just agree to disagree to ourselves.
@BashfulLoner 👏👏👏 Well said.
🤦🤦🤦🤦🤦🤦🤦🤦🤦
One must be careful not to make attribution errors. Enthusiast males across the board have a generally much harder time meeting or even getting responses from female enthusiasts. Not sure why any pros wouldn’t respond but maybe they’re busy or not very active.
From a social psychology standpoint, we are wired to want to engage with people who are friendly and engaging, and we are socialized in the US to smile in photos. All of your pics give off a sad, angry, and/or don’t-mess-with-me vibe. Which, in a space where women are already feeling uneasy about meeting strangers who may harm us, and are thus looking for any tiny cue to disqualify someone in order to stay safe (speaking for myself here but have heard similar sentiments from other women), this (not smiling and looking friendly in photos) could be a factor. Otherwise, your profile seems good - but your words and photos seem to contradict each other with how the viewer is left feeling, if that makes sense. Sometimes when we expect to be rejected we do things that lead to the outcome we fear and it becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy.
Honestly, I’ve been here two years and am extremely selective with who I actually meet. Most dudes get disqualified right out of the starting gate for different reasons, but especially in how they initiate that first conversation. (How do you approach that first chat? Could be a factor.) So it’s pretty rare for people to actually meet me in person and even rarer to get to cuddle with me. It’s not just you! Just my two cents, for what it’s worth. Best of luck to you and I hope you’re able to find some good peeps here.
Those of us who are trained pros, meaning we have gone through a certification program to be a professional cuddler, do not discriminate on any basis. That is part of our program. I hope that is not happening to you.
@Mare_Bear THERE'S TRAINING???
TELL ME MORE
@jabraham96. I get rejected/ignored all the time. Is it due to my race, too? Exactly which race do you think the Pros are accepting of?
@BashfulLoner thank you bro. You seem to be one of the few people here that genuinely understand my point of view. I knew I wasn’t feeling crazy. I get what others are my profile and pictures come off as unapproachable but I’m just looking for companionship and people to vibe with like everyone else. But I know as a black man I have to be careful and watch how I maneuver on this site. But I thank you again for really seeing things in my way @BashfulLoner
I have heard many stereotypes about cuddlers based on their race. Its definitely hurt me in the past because if I send someone my picture they have made assumptions about me based on what ethnicity they guess I am. More than half the time they guess wrong because I'm a mix.
I think its par for course that members of the majority will be offended or even deny that there's an issue. Finding cuddle partners is already difficult when men outnumber women 4:1, but if there's an extra bias or knock agst you then their % drops even more.
There are multiple studies that show there is an inherent systemic bias in different areas, which includes:
@BashfulLoner I guess like he said, it's not necessarily a malicious deal, but more a subtle bias or I feel a double standard. E.g. -
Then we see @jabraham96 's almost perfect profile get asked to be perfecter. Granted everyone can improve their profile, but he gets asked to do things that others haven't been asked.
Okay. I probably took it as far as I could go. I'm happy that I got this far without getting timed out. Thank you CC for letting this play out. I see more and more proof that the cuddle community is way more accepting than most communities.
I do suggest that pple consider that some areas of life don't always have a fair playing ground, to not shut down a discussion as soon as it occurs bc it makes you uncomfortable or bc it doesn't affect you, or to lecture to a minority that race or color doesn't matter. It does matter, it makes up some but not all of who we are, and there is a bias affects us in some but not all areas of life.
Also, try to see in what way you contribute or passively tolerate a system vs. being critical of or trying to improve it. At some point everyone has or will be the heel of the system, and if we can't acknowledge that there is an issue, then there won't be any changes.
References:
College professors respond: https://www.insidehighered.com/news/2014/04/24/study-finds-faculty-members-are-more-likely-respond-white-males-others
Employers respond: https://www.nber.org/digest/sep03/employers-replies-racial-names
Dating platform stats: https://www.gwern.net/docs/psychology/okcupid/howyourraceaffectsthemessagesyouget.html
Criminal justice study: https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2017/11/16/black-men-sentenced-to-more-time-for-committing-the-exact-same-crime-as-a-white-person-study-finds/
“But I know as a black man I have to be careful and watch how I maneuver on this site.“
So. After all the feedback you’ve gotten from numerous people, this is your takeaway.
It’s much easier to attribute negative outcomes to things beyond our control. That way we can claim no responsibility. It also leads to no change in what’s at least partially attributing to an outcome we claim to not want. This kind of attitude is plenty enough for me to not want to interact with someone who possesses it. Food for thought. 🤷🏽♀️
Unless we are mind readers we cannot know the reason why people didn’t respond. So many factors involved. I mean how many guys in here actually meet up with non pro women let alone get replies? I guess it wouldn’t hurt to look like Brad Pitt or Idris Elba. When it comes to pros yes they aren’t supposed to refuse for racial reasons, but we don’t know if that’s the case. We never will know. It’s not good to go through life thinking that way for anyone who attributes rejection of any kind to race. It’s bad for one’s mental health. It’s nihilistic for people to tell you yeah it’s because of this and that. Because I have lived through it. Everyone no matter if you share ethnicity, skin color, gender , etc. unless we have grown up in the same exact place, neighborhood, you can’t compare. Also for others not like you to affirm it, I find it a stretch and reeks of virtue signaling whenever you encounter it. Not saying it only pertains to here but in general.
Anyway the better your profile is the less hurdles you have
@cylee1180 brother don’t even waste your time explaining it, they’re not gonna understand or care to. I honestly appreciate you too bro
@jabraham96 No problem. It's worth trying to explain. There's good pple in Gotham. But yeah man, hope you get cuddles man. Everyone should have them.
@TheMidnightOwl ? What are you saying?
Felling zesty entertaining comments now? If anyone cares to learn.
I normally wouldn't shout out someone else's post, but I appreciated reading what you wrote, BashfulLoner.
As a side note, do you have any advice on developing tough skin ? Maybe a book or movie...
@GreyingBear i think it just develops but i recommend therapy and meditation. My path to dealing was reckless but luckily I’ve learned to find a way to subdue the silent rage. I probably still need some sort of counseling.
Cheers to the CC mods for letting this thread be voiced. I think even a discussion can get pple to think differently especially if there is reinforcement in the outside world. Also know that shows/movies like these are extremely popular for a reason:
They all treat racism in different ways: light comedy, gritty comedy , fantasy, and dark allegory.
People get rejected everyday, unfortunately it's one of those things where you have to suck it up and move on. Accept the situation and at some point learn how to beat the system. You could have the fanciest profile that would attract someone but there is always a reason to why they would reject you. Just learn to respect people's choices. It sucks and am sorry for you feeling the you feel.
Hope this statement helps, it is not meant to come across as sarcastic or offensive. Stay strong 💪😎
It's impossible to know for sure why you've been rejected (unless the person doing the rejecting straight up tells you why).
However.
It's definitely possible to look at reality and pick out reasons that are, on average, more likely than others.
This isn't a jab at anybody. So much basic decision-making is done subconsciously that it's easy to be biased without intending to be—without even realizing what you're doing! Most people don't consciously decide to ignore resumes with female or non-white names any more than they consciously decide to socially reject autistic people.
If you ask, they'll say they didn't even notice the color of the black guy's skin, or the autistic mannerisms of the autistic guy, didn't even consider the gender of the woman applying for the job: it was something else that turned them off, worried them, made them uninterested.
They're probably not lying. They didn't realize. Maybe they can't realize. What's to be done?
Of course you focus on making yourself extra appealing to overcome the ingrained prejudice—what else can you do?—but sometimes you really need to vent and be heard.
I'm sorry, @jabraham96. That sucks.
Is it just me or did this NO PERSONAL ATTACKS, @PrettyLuv [-Sid] just compare being black to those with disabilities?
Newsflash, being black is not a disability.
Talk about ingrained prejudices.
Agree to disagree, but don't even think this is going to be a sexist, racist, or anti-LGBTQ thread. Play nice, all, or this thread gets shut down, pronto. [-Sid]
@PrettyLuv Fair point. Only thing is Daring is not a bish, even though I don't disagree w him on this point.
Ah, the ole bootstraps lecture. It's all good. I produce 3-4x more than my co workers but receive 2x the criticism.
Also, during the pandemic, the odds that someone that looks like me becomes the recipient of a hate crime went up 2-3x according to the DOJ. I can walk on the street and me or my elder relative can get donkey punched for just existing. Actually, I was a victim of a hate crime in the work place - not a good work week, I'll tell you that, but it didn't affect my work.
I don't care that pple have different opinions, but I think pple who benefit the most from unjust systems are the first ones to sweep its inequalities or inconveniences under the rug. And tbh, being Asian in the system ain't even half as bad as some other folks have it way worse. That's your All Lives Matter rant for the day lol - and for the record that statement sucks! It's just a gag phrase to get the marginalized folks to shut up and return to regularly scheduled programming. *Mic drop. Have a good day folks.
@PrettyLuv . Agreed
Why do people speak of things as if they cancel each other out? So because someone is smacked by by 8 people in a room and manages to smack 2 back, he didn’t just get his add whooped by a gang? And the child, woman, an elderly person, and a person with bad eczema get hit once, it doesn’t matter that some of those hit him as well it doesn’t matter that he got dragged by people who get the same treatment as him?
This ain’t a competition in misery. Accept what happens in this world and don’t dismiss other’s experiences because yours a different. All you have to do is listen and try to understand.
It shows you think of others as less than. The words you say are telling a much different story than the action of what you’re saying. To discriminate is an action, a verb. So is listening and learning, an action. Even if you do neither it’s an active choice.
@jabraham96 Been on this site for about four years, and have had a ton of success off and on, but mostly with dozens of cuddlers in Georgia and Arizona. Recently moved to California and have finally had two bad experiences, in back-to-back weeks. I am non-white, but did my bland profile/mixed-race contribute to my recent string of bad luck? Maybe a little, but probably not. Every area is going to have its own unique culture and you may have to adjust accordingly to the one that you are in. Not sure if you're like me and grew up in a black neighborhood where everybody had a survivalist mentality and smiling was frowned upon even for happy people, but I have learned that in order to remain a relatively successful black male in our society and to be somewhat accepted, I have to sometimes first go out of my way to make people feel more comfortable. It's not fair, and can be draining, but it also ain't the end of the world! People that are non-white tend to not get the benefit of the doubt in most situations (one exception is showing up to play pick-up basketball as the new guy in a white area...I am always one of the first picks, and I am not even that good! Haha), but that doesn't mean that we can't work around that fact to get what we want out of life. Your pics will easily put you into the "angry black man" trope for people that didn't grow up where I am from and know of great friendly black men that aren't always smiley/giggly, so I would scrap them all together. I have never been able to meet an enthusiast off here, but the fact that I am willing to pay $$$ to a pro for strictly-platonic cuddling has so far superseded the need for me to put a pic up or actually flesh out my profile at all.
So glad you posted this @ninjaturtle. I had wondered if cultural difference could be a factor. And it is too bad that people sometimes have to go out of their way and/or adjust to be accepted in some social situations. But you made a lot of good points and offered good advice/food for thought in a friendly, kind and wise way. I'm glad you saw fit to join this thread and enlighten us, or at least me:)