@sunnysideup the issue you had is not being able to get women to meet you in public. The issue I've seen Pros have in the pro forum is no matter how many things a pro does to try to screen without real-world information (they try a phone call, video chat, meeting in public first, a picture) they still get groped.
@MaineCuddle And I'm always so sorry to hear that. Hopefully you've found a screening process that works for you.
@sunnysideup I can see your profile could use a bit of improvement, if you want feedback feel free to message. As I don't want to derail this post.
Other than that... perhaps your messaging or something could improve. So feel free to message me what you tried and which you think failed. Though I doubt most of it is about you, because based on seeing you in the forums and reading your profile you come across well intentioned. I think it's mostly a matter of luck, avillability, numbers, and the pandemic doesn't help the situation.
The trolls are out in force. Folks - please flag and report as appropriate. @squeakytoy and I are happy to show folks the proverbial door.
@sunnysideup in support of @MaineCuddle's initiative you may find these threads helpful... you may have seen them already of course, but for the benefit of the lurkers and new people in a similar situation to you ....
https://www.cuddlecomfort.com/forum/discussion/10731/how-i-found-happiness-on-cuddle-comfort#top
https://www.cuddlecomfort.com/forum/discussion/11489/how-i-found-happiness-on-cc-part-2-the-first-meeting#top
The amount of gaslighting from some men on this post does an excellent if depressing job of validating the OPs post.
As to self-shame vs self-awareness, it can be hard to draw that line. As men, we’re taught poorly. I hope boys are being taught better now, but growing up in the 80s and early 90s, I can’t tell you the number of adult men in my life who joked about things like “no means yes” or said “she’s playing hard to get.”
This was a near-universal thing, prevalent in entertainment as well as real life. I don’t know a middle aged man who is honest who can say they weren’t taught that by at least some men in their lives.
It required a process of unlearning. And it requires a constant self-examination of actions to make sure that the unlearning sticks and that we are not passing on those bad lessons to other men and boys.
I see plenty of men here in this thread and out in the world who have not unlearned them lessons of entitlement and who have no desire to do so, and women who have been victimized because of it.
And that brings me shame. I would hope it would bring all of us dudes some shame. That’s part of self awareness, it can be a positive motivator.
I think self-hatred is a thing to avoid.
I'm so grateful that I had a mom who was gentle and nurturing to me, and engendered compassion. My sister has walked a similar path, raising three gentlemen. I wish that I could say that I was never thoughtlessly stomping around engrossed in male privilege, but I eventually woke up. Women are trafficked under the public's nose. How does that happen unless people are willfully blind? We expect women to put up with intense crap and shut up about it. All this resentment about the premise is very telling, that not only is it real but too many people can't even see it when they're looking straight at it. What I cannot understand is the huge amount of Stockholm syndrome, which if that ever stopped one day we'd see an immense bloodbath. Guys... Why the knee jerk reaction if there isn't something going on here? The overreactive emotion is a signal that some programming is getting triggered. Do you see it yet?
@UCpaaHVg6u0 Well stated. I've learned that if I feel defensive about any kind of generalization that someone makes, I need to ask myself why.
Just like a tall person doesn't need to wear a shirt that says, "I am tall", a true gentleman doesn't need to loudly proclaim, "I'm a good guy!" In both cases it's clearly self-evident.
@natickben @UCpaaHVg6u0 Just having awareness of these issues is what changes peoples' actions in subtle ways and makes all the difference - it's always good to acknowledge the past and consider the way it influences things today. But I also agree that self-hatred should be avoided! We can't help but be shaped by our upbringings and societal influence. If we're making the effort to understand now, that's what matters.
@JoyfulHeart This made me laugh, it's a great comparison
@squeakytoy I AM tall, by the way. 🤪😁
But most important thing is that You are all beautiful amazing people.
@UCpaaHVg6u0 hi there my only point in my original post was imagine if you substituted the word man with any ethnic group. Would it not seem offensive or rude? Just responding to where you said “why the knee jerk reaction if there isn’t something there. .” Sorry just paraphrasing. Just trying to see if people think it would be offensive if that was a post. Not trolling in any way.
I want to add, even if women become comfortable with you in a public setting, it can still take time for them to feel safe with you in a private setting.
Also I recognize that there’s a power dynamic involved between men and women and there should always be caution taken whenever meeting any strangers and I have no issue when women are speaking about their feelings, fears and concerns with men. Very valid and appreciative of them expressing it and I listen. Many of these things I have heard and learned from emulate relatives and friends. Useful for men who have not. My issue is when men in here or in general seem to always pile and go even further than women do. And what @squeakytoy said self hatred shouldn’t be taking place. It just seems like the same few guys over and over pile on in threads about men. Anywho.
@supadupa "And what @squeakytoy said self hatred shouldn’t be taking place."
I think we all agree that the very first opening of the OP's message has self hatred and we don't want him or anyone to feel that way*. 🫂
However it doesn't take away from the overall good message that he's trying to send.
"It just seems like the same few guys over and over pile on in threads about men. Anywho."
Besides the already addressed issue, I don't see men piling on other men in the threads. If anything I see men who don't know basic respect and a few men who say* something. Who are kind and understanding of our struggles. Unfortunately, these types of conversations will always come around so long as these types of issues are around. And I'd say, we as a society, don't properly address and stand up against it half as much as it happens. In case you, or anyone is tired of hearing about the times it's raised here and there: imagine how it feels to be a victim of these issues at least twice a month, if not more.
@Lovelight thanks for responding I appreciate it. I’m tired of the same dudes piling on. If they truly mean it, that’s one thing but if it’s just a ploy to look good to the women posters then that’s another thing. I hear you about what women have to face and shutting up about that. My issue isn’t with what women face and when women post. I was just wondering from them if the word man was replaced with an ethnicity wouldn’t it be offensive?
@supadupa - way to go off topic. I don't know how you think swapping gender for ethnicity makes this anything other than trolling. Welcome to timeout. Message me (@Sideon) or @squeakytoy if we have completely misunderstood your unfortunate attempt. [-Sid]
I think that one thing I inherently disagree with is the idea that something about being a man makes you inherently more likely to be malicious than if you were a woman.
I prefer to see women as complete human beings, capable of both good and bad, just like their male counterparts
Male malicousness is easy to spot because it is often physical and non subtle.
Female maliciousness is more subtle, cerebral and emotional as those are the weapons that are easier to access. Since these things aren't physical they are harder to pinpoint.
@supadupa "I was just wondering from them if the word man was replaced with an ethnicity wouldn’t it be offensive?"
Myself and others have already addressed that.
"I’m tired of the same dudes piling on. If they truly mean it, that’s one thing but if it’s just a ploy to look good to the women posters then that’s another thing."
Again, this goes back to what I just said... you can read it again.
I don't believe that they are doing it to look good, makes me wonder why you feel that way. I trust that they mean well and care, until given* a good reason to think that there's a bad or two apple, which I know can happen. It seems to me, you should join * or at least, leave it to those who want to talk about it * rather than be "tired of it", because your frustration seems misdirected to me. If people were treating you like their punching* bag, I doubt you'd feel tired of* the same people expressing their objection to it for as long as they need to and trying to improve your life.
@supadupa My guess is that it would be offensive if someone was offended by it. Another question might be whether such a post could be made about an ethnic group and be true. If it is true, it might still offend some people and not others.
Generalizations can be problematic, for sure. They almost never represent every member of the group being generalized. That said, they often represent some members of that group, and it can sometimes be useful to see how other groups perceive the group in question.
Looking at a concept like that doesn't mean that I'm accepting personal fault in the matter, it just means that, as a member of that group, I have an opportunity to improve how my group is perceived.
I see this as a positive thing, and not as an attack on my character. I admit that in the past I might have struggled with it more than I do now. Even if I think that something has been said imperfectly, there's still the possibility of finding applicable truth.
I also hope that it's clear that nothing I've said in this thread has been intended as an insult to men in general or to any of the men present. I merely acknowledge the fact that as a group, we're human, and humans can always learn and grow.
Is it just me or are there a lot of Swiss army logos on site today ? Oh wait they look similar to the banned logo here. 🤪carry on.
@supadupa As am old movie buff (old= me and the movies, both) I like to occasionally relate topics of discussion to movie scenes. In our discussion, reference "In the Heat of the Night" scene where Endicott takes offense at what an African American says to him and quickly backhands him across the face, but Tibbs immediately backhands him right back. The triggering is this case was based on the expectations of deference that used to be prevalent. I think this idea of "... substituted the word..." is a justification, and not the reason why you feel triggered.
@OhioMike we suspect quite a few of them to be the same guy.
@UCpaaHVg6u0 I think you're probably right.
Don’t you think posts like this alienate your main base in which you generate revenue? Lets be real, the majority of the appointments here are men paying women to cuddle with. The forums are so toxic and it’s the same delusional people preaching how men are predators or safety! And Consent!! You’d think that every other cuddle session here ends up in an assault case. Frankly, it’s makes a lot us Paying male customers feel unwelcomed and want to just say is this worth it.
@supadupa I dont speak out on women's rights, their needs , and the power dynamic between genders to make myself look good . I already look good per my character, actions, and how I treat folks . I do it because it is what I believe in, and I speak out about things I believe in .
@Libra0 I'm sorry you have a problem with safety and consent.
@Libra0
"Don’t you think posts like this alienate your main base in which you generate revenue? Lets be real, the majority of the appointments here are men paying women to cuddle with. The forums are so toxic and it’s the same delusional people preaching how men are predators or safety! And Consent!! You’d think that every other cuddle session here ends up in an assault case. Frankly, it’s makes a lot us Paying male customers feel unwelcomed and want to just say is this worth it."
@Libra0 if you feel unwelcomed by people wanting to set up safe boundaries...
In all seriousness, this thread and others aren't about you IF you don't do those things. However; even a real "gentleman", as @CharlesThePoet put it, needs to recognize that there is an uneven power dynamic at work. "Not all men are like that" and "Women can be like that too" are not false, but the fact of the matter is that most assaults or worse are by men, to women when it comes to this sort of interaction.
Because of this fact, it should be everyone's responsibility to scrutinize male behavior a little more closely, including your own. It's not a bad thing to realize what the actual 'red flags' are, and figure out what a green flag looks like so you can advertise that about yourself.
Assuming you have no ill intent, there are still things you might do accidentally. As a fellow tall person like @JoyfulHeart, I'm hyper-aware of the space I take up. I'm not a mean guy but I'm sure I can look frightening. I see it on faces when I walk into a room. Sure I can blame everyone else for pre-judging me but honestly, that's a harder way to live. We all carry outward signs on us that are perceived in ways beyond our control. Understanding them and acting accordingly is important.
@Big_Chris
Assuming you have no ill intent, there are still things you might do accidentally.
This reminds me of a dancing analogy from real life. I once took lessons for a while, and during a session, I stepped forward when I should have stepped back. She was wearing open-toed shoes, and it took off part of a nail.
The lack of intent on my part didn't reduce the physical pain. I could have added emotional pain as well by loudly proclaiming that I hadn't done anything wrong. Even though I was morally innocent, I was materially responsible. I was given instruction by the teacher. I felt bad for my partner's pain, but I didn't beat myself up over it. I did, however, welcome the instruction given.
Relationships of all kinds can be like a dance. We can accidentally hurt people. Learning to be better dancers helps fewer people to get hurt. This thread contains dancing instructions.
@Big_Chris eloquently put!
@Robert777 I don't fear men nor women, but maaaaaaaan do you not understand the tone or general points of the main topic. In my perspective you took it personally then wrote it as a general statement. It's getting harder for men to be with gals bc women are growing as a community and will not tolerate anything less than what they deserve. As a professional, I will say that I have had to cut a lot of men out including repeats bc of not getting the hint, body language, tone, nor direct communication.