That sounds really lovely, @warm_embrace
@squeakytoy @littermate @DarrenWalker I have female friends ( obviously adults lol ) who refer to time spent exclusively with other female friends as “ girls night “ or they’re taking a “ girls trip “ their words not mine. Obviously all parties involved are adult females. Same with me when I get together with my other male friends , it’s common for one of us to say “ A night out with the boys “ . If someone on here said “ They met up with a girl in Philly from CC for a cuddle sesh “ I would hope we would all have enough common sense ( at least I would ) to understand they were referring to an adult female & and that’s probably just typical verbiage wherever they’re from or a generational thing maybe. Also @littermate While the 3rd pic may be comfortable attire for you or some but I’m sure there are other grown women who don’t like to wear jeans and are more comfortable in other types of attire. I see a lot of women in the 2nd pic dressed that way for renaissance festivals and stuff like that.
@hugonehugall Did you see what I wrote about in-crowd language? That applies to what you said about "girls' night" and "girls' trip". There's no problem there, and I already explained why.
The issue at hand with calling adult women "girls" is not "we misunderstand and think you're literally confusing an adult woman with a child", the issue is that when you use "girl" to describe an adult woman, it's diminutive in an insulting way, and has really terrible, degrading historical roots. As far as I can tell, @DarrenWalker was calling this out in a teasing way.
Using the word "boys" in "night out with the boys" has no historical tie to oppression and degradation, but a white dude calling a black dude "boy" has an entirely different meaning.
But yeah, I see “They met up with a girl in Philly from CC for a cuddle sesh" just as insulting as “They met up with a chick in Philly from CC for a cuddle sesh".
Does this help clarify things?
EDIT:
that’s probably just typical verbiage wherever they’re from or a generational thing maybe.
I wanted to add, this is never a valid excuse. We all have the choice to be better people and keep up with the times.
@squeakytoy Good explanation. Thank you for the needed education.
@squeakytoy 1st I assure you as a black male in America I know the negative connotations with the word boy in our history ..... no need to explain that to me thanks. And as far as being called “girl “ as woman yeah it’s insulting to you and when dealing specifically with you I will keep that in mind but another woman @Amortentia has spoken up and said she’s not personally insulted by it so it also may be personal preference thing as well .
People do offensive stuff without realizing how offensive it is all the time... for example dressing up as a famous black person for Halloween. I didn't realize that using the word "girl" referring to an adult woman was offensive until now. What about the term "girlfriend"?
@squeakytoy: Exactly right—a teasing call-out is exactly what I was going for in my first comment.
@hugonehugall: I used to talk to a black man who liked being called "boy." A personal preference thing. Still... I default to more polite address with black men in general until told otherwise, you know?
Best to do that with women too, I figure. And, well... with everyone, really.
Sorry @hugonehugall , I made an assumption about your race and I shouldn't have - that wasn't cool of me, and I apologize.
Thanks for not referring to me as "girl". I think when it comes to this, it's better to err on the side of caution unless a woman explicitly says she's fine with being called girl. Like @DarrenWalker said.
@Mike403 As far as I know, "girlfriend" is as innocuous as "boyfriend". And yeah, people certainly do offensive stuff all the time - I think we're all doomed to be offensive sometimes. But I think what matters most is how you respond when you're called out on it.
@Mmart Thanks, I appreciate you reading through it
@DarrenWalker I’ve had white friends in past say about me or tell me “ That’s my boy !! “ or “ You’re my boy !!! “ in a positive context or in an endearing way. Never did I relate it to a much uglier time in this country’s past. It’s good you at least heard out your friend’s preferences instead of making assumptions or lumping him in with the masses.
@Handsomewheels Big goofy grin. Some people get me. Some. people. just. don't. And hello to those who take me literally. That's fun too in a different way. @squeakytoy I can feel the celestial spheres vibrating, Thank you. @Mmart I have seldom seen a more wonderful response to such information and I bow and thank you. Nice modeling. @hugonehugall nice on the "as a black male in America" wake up for all of us.
I find the age old attitudes of women as little fillies to be insulting, and to the extent that that is the unconscious, unexamined current in the water beneath a person's word choice, words can carry and perpetuate insult and moreover, have unconscious tendrils into the very attitudes that spawned and continue to spawn violence against and the domination of women. In the mouth of someone who gets it, who is playing with those words on top of an awareness of historical attitudes and their effects on groups of people, who one feels bonded to, it can be fine, even fun.
The defense that it varies and you just have to ask people is valid AND leading with that belies a level of defensiveness that says "I feel tight in here and am more interested in defending my goodness than I am in hearing what you are saying." Understandable. We women have a history of educating in not so friendly a manner. But if you're out and about in the world as a man you are much more likely to get warm and fuzzy feelings from us peeps who identify as women if you use that word to refer to us. You're welcome.
There are contexts within which any of these words are groovy and cool, and contexts within which they display someone a bit out of touch, a bit insensitive or uneducated or with their attention somewhere else besides playing well with others. That's all cool. Those peeps get to cuddle too. They just aren't my preference. Carry on with your wonderful selves.
To argue when a woman puts out a fine bit of education (@squeakytoy), well is that someone who is going to also argue about a boundary I set because THEY don't see it that way?
Attack away. I have spoken. (Heh heh @ChefKate)
There is an important point here which I don't think has been mentioned. Many of the uses of boy or are girl which are acceptable occur between people who are friends or family.
In other words, it's really about formality and familiarity. Calling your friend a girl may well be fine: but calling a stranger girl is not.
Part of the problem that occurs here is that because cuddling is an intimate, familiar activity, some people think [wrongly] that they can be familiar with people in the cuddling world that they don't yet know.
(There are also cultural differences. When I was a young child in the Scottish Highlands, all men could be referred to as 'boy'. 'Girl' could be used freely for any woman under about 50, and jocularly or familiarly for any woman over about 70. It was only for women between 50-70 that you couldn't do it. It wasn't particularly offensive, it just was never ever done and therefore would simply cause confusion.)
Yeah I clicked on this thread to answer the original question but got sidetracked by all the bickering.
So yes my partner knows that I cuddle and when I do. We’re in an ethical non-monogamous relationship; so it’s easier to explain and get acceptance compared to a normy relationship.
@soeseu - It's human nature to bicker. I can post a picture of a rock and call it a rock, and somebody will find a way to argue about it.
I can feel the celestial spheres vibrating, Thank you.
@littermate Thanks, hopefully they keep the Covid away And thanks for adding onto what I said.
@Mike403 it is not a rock. It is a carbon and mineral based object for which to trip on
@pmvines: No, it's Jesus.
@littermate Your posts are educational also. Thank you for making that effort. I have always thought of myself as a pretty good guy but I have found through this site that I need continued education. Thanks to you and the other women on this site for helping provide that.
@pmvines @DarrenWalker - You're both incorrect. It's Apple's new product.
@DarrenWalker hmmm so then I should eat its flesh and drink its blood ? But you can't get blood from a stone ?
@pmvines: Put the solid, stony flesh of a rock in your mouth, bite down hard, and you'll have plenty of blood! And with transubstantiation and all, well. 👍🏻
@Mmart Thanks. I generally assume most are well-meaning and we call could use an education. I have learned so much on these forums and elsewhere. I hope I never stop learning and never stop honing my capacity to understand another as well as express what seems true here. You modeled humility and it was beautiful.
@hugonehugall boy, you better watch what you say 😂😂
I’m with @Amortentia I don’t mind being called girl, lady, chicky. It’s all good with me. I can tell if someone is saying it to me to be rude or belittling. It’s like how I call people hun. It’s out of absolute habit and endearment. If someone doesn’t like it, tell me. Either than that, this is who I am. I will say it. Call me girl. That’s what I am lol
@Sheena123 Yeah yeah don’t make me come after your tooth !!! But thank you for understanding what I was trying to say .
@hugonehugall you’re too much of a sweetheart to mean wrong to me lol except your taste in music. That’s very questionable 😂😂
@Sheena123 I’m making a Nelly Furtado appreciation thread .... just for you
@hugonehugall oh no. Where’s the closest door? Lol
To answer the thread, I asked my husband what he thought of me being a pro cuddler and he supports me through and through 😊 he’s always worried for my safety but we have our system that makes us feel comfortable. 🌸🌸
Back on track here for a bit. The OP was mentioning potential partners. Like I said don’t think it’s information you owe someone on a 1st date or if it’s someone you’re trying to decide you want to date but once you decide it’s someone you have more than a casual interest in they need to know what you do for a living lol.
@hugonehugall I agree you don't owe someone on a first date, but I would guess that employment is a topic on a first date virtually 100% of the time.
Now that you mention it, @Mmart ... that's true! I don't think I've ever had a first date where we didn't mention what we did for a living. So I guess if I were a professional cuddler on here, and was also dating, it would lead to some interesting first date conversations
@squeakytoy Yes. it could get awkward from the get go. I mean, how do you avoid the question? Or do you lie? Or do you reveal and take your chances?